Camball trumps Martyball

[SDRANGER619]

Very interesting article; I had no idea...

Camball trumps Martyball


Cameron speaks up: He's making the calls

By Jay Posner
UNION-TRIBUNE STAFF WRITER

November 10, 2006

http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniontrib/20061110/images/sp-chargers180.jpg

Cam Cameron says he is "never overruled" by Marty Schottenheimer on play calls.

Cam Cameron wanted to make one thing perfectly clear: As the Chargers' offensive coordinator, he calls every play.

He calls the plays that work, that helped the Chargers score 40 points against Tennessee or 48 points against San Francisco. And he calls the plays that don't work – including every play in that oh-so-aggravating 16-13 loss six weeks ago in Baltimore.

Not surprisingly, that game, the one that made Martyball a four-letter word again throughout Chargerville, was a major topic yesterday on the one day during the 2006 season that Cameron was (and will be) allowed to speak with reporters.

For one thing, Cameron said he is never overruled on play calls.

“Just to put that to rest,” he said, “I think Dean Spanos, A.J. Smith and Marty Schottenheimer have not called any plays this year.” So Martyball is really Camball?

“I'm going to put it this way: When things are not going the way everyone wants them to go, it's Camball,” he said.

At the same time, Cameron also said “it would look selfish on my part to think that it's me. It's not me. It's us, offensively, win, lose or draw. But I have no problem. I know I'm accountable.”

“The second half of Baltimore, I'm not pleased with what took place there,” Cameron said. “And I'm going to go ahead and address it for you because every call was a call that was felt to be right. In hindsight, when things don't turn out, we all know what wasn't called is what you should have called.”

But what wasn't called, Cameron said, had nothing to do with Martyball. He said Schottenheimer did not order the Chargers to play that way on that day. And Cameron said he knows better than to ever think he could play conservatively and win.

“That was not the thought process,” he said. “Most coordinators have learned this a long time ago. . . . To think that you're going to pull one out being conservative, you're really fooling yourself. You're not going to win. You may keep games close, but you're not going to win.”

So what happened? Cameron said he knew the Chargers were facing an “outstanding” defense and the top priority would be pass protection. But then something strange happened: “We ran the ball better than we ever dreamed we'd run against them, because no one had run the ball on them,” he said.

“And I got a little enamored with the running game. Handing the ball to LaDainian Tomlinson just has never been perceived to me as conservative. But in hindsight you look at it and then all those things took place, you could kick yourself right in the rear end. So if that happens again, then shoot me. Whatever.”

But Cameron also pointed out he has to take into account the Chargers have a “great punter” and a “great defense.” And that sometimes “being conservative at a certain time helps you win the game.”

He added: “It's not what everybody wants, but it may be the best thing to win the game and that's where I've got to take my ego, and everybody else's, and make the decision I think is right. And I'm not afraid to do that. Unfortunately, I know I'm not always going to be right.
“That almost seems like two years ago, but I owed it to you to address it, and see you guys next year.”

Actually, he discussed other subjects, but as anyone would expect, there were no surprises. The bottom line: “We're eight games in . . . and I believe and I think our guys believe we're just scratching the surface of what we can be offensively to help this team win.”

Defensive coordinator Wade Phillips also answered questions; one of the primary topics was the Chargers' performance late in games such as Baltimore and Kansas City. Phillips said the team was not playing a “prevent” defense, but occasionally his defenders “play it a lot looser than what you want.”

Continued Phillips: “It's still hard for them to not play a little bit cautious because you're afraid of giving up a play that beats you, and then you give up a lot of them underneath and we don't want to do that.

“We work on it, talk about it, we walk through it, but until you get in the game in those situations enough, it's harder for them to realize. Especially the underneath players, they need to play a little tighter than what we play sometimes.”

http://www.signonsandiego.com/images/utbullets/utbullet.gifJay Posner: (619) 293-1834; jay.posner@uniontrib.com (http://www.signonsandiego.com/sports/chargers/MAILTO:jay.posner@uniontrib.com)

[benji929]

Thanks for the article. It's good to see Cam taking responsibility. Of course, that won't stop anyone from calling for Marty's head anytime there is questionable playcalling.

[JCDavey]

nice to see cam take that bullet
that's very rivers-ish

[FanSince1979]

Very smart move on Cam's part. He'll keep his Head Coach very happy by taking all responsibility for the play calling. Does that mean that Marty doesn't go over the game plan with him during the week too? I'm a bit confused as to what Marty does now? Is he truly just a cheerleader?

[TCUFAN5]

he just listens and nodds his head..

[JCDavey]

he just listens and nodds his head..like the bobblehead in the jeep commercial

http://www.businessweek.com/the_thread/brandnewday/archives/jeep_4.jpg

[TJ21]

Very smart move on Cam's part. He'll keep his Head Coach very happy by taking all responsibility for the play calling. Does that mean that Marty doesn't go over the game plan with him during the week too? I'm a bit confused as to what Marty does now? Is he truly just a cheerleader?
So obviously you think the only responsibilities of a head coach are to call plays. Very "Madden Fanboi" of you. How about teaching the players technique, form, administrating his coordinators (making sure they're doing their jobs), deciding which players to sit and start, consulting with team doctors, assistants, motivating everyone on the team, going over game film every day.

Looks like when many, including myself said Cam calls the plays, and many including you Chad, said Marty overrules the plays and calls all the runs... the guys who believed what was said, over "what Cam wanted to say but couldn't" were right.

:good:

[Sanitation Man]

So obviously you think the only responsibilities of a head coach are to call plays. Very "Madden Fanboi" of you. How about teaching the players technique, form, administrating his coordinators (making sure they're doing their jobs), deciding which players to sit and start, consulting with team doctors, assistants, motivating everyone on the team, going over game film every day.

Looks like when many, including myself said Cam calls the plays, and many including you Chad, said Marty overrules the plays and calls all the runs... the guys who believed what was said, over "what Cam wanted to say but couldn't" were right.

:good:

LMAO!!! :D :D :D

[JoeMcRugby]

That makes it two years in a row that Cam has lied about the obvious - that he's a puppet and Marty does the playcalling whenever things go wrong.

I guess he doesn't want a headcoaching job too badly - nobody will hire a liar.

;)

[FanSince1979]

I guess some people don't have the NFL Network. Just watch some of the Games of the Week, and notice that Marty does indeed tell Cam what to do at times. However, if Marty is not over-ruling poor play-calling, then he simply isn't doing his job.

Also, Cam has said "I know what he wants." So, while Cam may call most plays, he calls what he thinks his employer wants.

[Ikeman83]

That makes it two years in a row that Cam has lied about the obvious - that he's a puppet and Marty does the playcalling whenever things go wrong.

I guess he doesn't want a headcoaching job too badly - nobody will hire a liar.

;)

Maybe Cam is really a Machine! Or a human puppet of Marty. Think about it, we never see Marty next to either of his coordinators at the same time, how do we know that Cam isn't a machine???

I want proof...

[FanSince1979]

That makes it two years in a row that Cam has lied about the obvious - that he's a puppet and Marty does the playcalling whenever things go wrong.

I guess he doesn't want a headcoaching job too badly - nobody will hire a liar.

;)Do you believe that Marty has no input on the "type" of plays that Cam calls? If not, how do you explain Marty's desire to control the clock? Is that just something he likes, or something that he influences as head of all the coaches. (I.e., Head Coach.)

I have never claimed that Marty calls the plays, but I know for a fact that he has told Cam what type of plays to call.

Is it Cam that decides to go for it on 4th and 1 or is that Marty? Is it Marty who decides to punt or go for a FG? Or is that Cam's decision? Is it Marty's decision to run the ball on 3rd and long to setup a FG in the playoffs, or is it Cam that makes that executive decision?

[JCDavey]

Maybe Cam is really a Machine! Or a human puppet of Marty. Think about it, we never see Marty next to either of his coordinators at the same time, how do we know that Cam isn't a machine???

I want proof...marty has control of the black smoke monster from lost, and he's been using it to mimic cam!

[JoeMcRugby]

Do you believe that Marty has no input on the "type" of plays that Cam calls? If not, how do you explain Marty's desire to control the clock? Is that just something he likes, or something that he influences as head of all the coaches. (I.e., Head Coach.)

I have never claimed that Marty calls the plays, but I know for a fact that he has told Cam what type of plays to call.

Is it Cam that decides to go for it on 4th and 1 or is that Marty? Is it Marty who decides to punt or go for a FG? Or is that Cam's decision? Is it Marty's decision to run the ball on 3rd and long to setup a FG in the playoffs, or is it Cam that makes that executive decision?

During the week, the Chargers' coaching staff (with Marty's input) comes up with a gameplan. On Sunday, Marty lets Cam and Wade make the calls based on the gameplan formulation.

Either Cam is lying again, or he's talking out of his butt when he says that running the ball that much was not part of the gameplan that was formulated during the week.

Cam said that they didn't expect to run the ball as effectively as they did in the first half. As a result, Cam said that he made more run calls in the second half than was the game plan that was formulated with Marty's input.

Obviously, Cam is lying. We all know that Marty told Cam to avoid passing at all costs all week long and told Cam to run the ball every time if they had a lead.

[FanSince1979]

During the week, the Chargers' coaching staff (with Marty's input) comes up with a gameplan. On Sunday, Marty lets Cam and Wade make the calls based on the gameplan formulation.

Either Cam is lying again, or he's talking out of his butt when he says that running the ball that much was not part of the gameplan that was formulated during the week.

Cam said that they didn't expect to run the ball as effectively as they did in the first half. As a result, Cam said that he made more run calls in the second half than was the game plan that was formulated with Marty's input.

Obviously, Cam is lying. We all know that Marty told Cam to avoid passing at all costs all week long and told Cam to run the ball every time if they had a lead.I agree with the bolded part. I find the rest of the comments about Cam lying or talking out of his butt unlikely.

Did you understand my question about Marty being involved in telling Cam, as the Head Coach, what "type" of plays to call, as opposed to which exact plays to call?

What did Marty mean when he told Cam on the NFL Game of the Week to "Shuv the ball down their throats"? Was he telling Cam to throw the ball?

Again: Is it Cam that decides to go for it on 4th and 1 or is that Marty? Is it Marty who decides to punt or go for a FG? Or is that Cam's decision? Is it Marty's decision to run the ball on 3rd and long to setup a FG in the playoffs, or is it Cam that makes that executive decision?

[Ikeman83]

I think that this whole line of debate is moronic, and here's why.

Regardless of whether Marty or Cam makes the playcalls, Marty, Cam, and the position coaches go into the week with a gameplan, and a practice schedule that they execute and perform all week leading up to gameday. Whether you believe it is Marty or Cam making the decisions, the coaching staff as a unit makes the decisions on the overall strategy to execute.

Moreover, the first 15 plays are scripted. You can't get angry with any individual for whatever happens in the first fifteen plays. As far as the remaining playcalls, you have to recall that in any situation, the players have to execute. It doesn't matter what they call if the players don't perform their assignment properly.

There were many opportunities in the Baltimore game to win, and players did not execute. There were also many mistakes in the opening few series of the KC game to have a legit shot at winning.

The coaches could come up with the perfect gameplan and one missed block, dropped ball, or defensive play can ruin it.

[The-Beast]

He may call all the plays, but marty most definitly has some words of advice to cam before the play is called.

[DutchCheddar]

I think it's asinine for anyone to think they know what's being said either in meetings or on game day between two coaches.

Now, if you're telling me that you're sitting in those meetings or you have a headset on during the games, then this is all just speculation and you're just "talking out of your butt."

[MadMadigan]

It's a stupid argument, but where was Cam all those years that created the term "Martyball" in the first place.

Yeah, it's all Cam :rolleyes:

Who cares anyways, so far the problem has been corrected and thats all that really matters.

[FanSince1979]

It's a stupid argument, but where was Cam all those years that created the term "Martyball" in the first place.

Yeah, it's all Cam :rolleyes:

Who cares anyways, so far the problem has been corrected and thats all that really matters.Poor Marty has been cursed with conservative offensive coordinators for the past 20 years. ;)

[MadMadigan]

Poor Marty has been cursed with conservative offensive coordinators for the past 20 years. ;)Nothing would make me happier Than to See Marty win a Chargers Superbowl Game. And be rewarded for many years of hard work, he certainly deserves it. our whole staff does, Marty isnt the only one on our Staff that has been to many playoffs and some to a few Superbowls and never won The big one. I'm pretty sure AJ was with Buffalo when they went those few years.

If we make it to the playoffs this year, im not really worried about going out the same way many Marty playoff games went out. if we go and lose, it wont be because of conservaative playcalling this year.

[FanSince1979]

Nothing would make me happier Than to See Marty win a Chargers Superbowl Game. And be rewarded for many years of hard work, he certainly deserves it. our whole staff does, Marty isnt the only one on our Staff that has been to many playoffs and some to a few Superbowls and never won The big one. I'm pretty sure AJ was with Buffalo when they went those few years.

If we make it to the playoffs this year, im not really worried about going out the same way many Marty playoff games went out. if we go and lose, it wont be because of conservaative playcalling this year.I'm thinking and hoping for the same thing. :Beer:

[StevenSD]

Poor Marty has been cursed with conservative offensive coordinators for the past 20 years. ;)

You know, I've read a lot of your posts, and you seem real immature for someone born in 1979.

[FanSince1979]

You know, I've read a lot of your posts, and you seem real immature for someone born in 1979.Well, I was born in 67, but thanks.

[JoeMcRugby]

It's a stupid argument, but where was Cam all those years that created the term "Martyball" in the first place.

Yeah, it's all Cam :rolleyes:

Who cares anyways, so far the problem has been corrected and thats all that really matters.

Cam wasn't there when Marty's QBs were Steve Deberg, Elvis Grbac, Steve Bono and Dave Krieg. Somehow, I doubt any sane offensive coordinator would get in a passing war with those guys when facing Dan Marino, Jim Kelly and John Elway in playoff games. ;)

When Marty had Bernie Kosar and end-of-his-career Joe Montana as his QBs, Marty's offensive coordinators winged the ball all over the place. Sadly, it wasn't enough to beat two of the three Hall of Fame QBs in AFC Championship Games- largely due to "the Drive", "The Fumble" and "The Injury".

[FanSince1979]

Cam wasn't there when Marty's QBs were Steve Deberg, Elvis Grbac, Steve Bono and Dave Krieg. Somehow, I doubt any sane offensive coordinator would get in a passing war with those guys when facing Dan Marino, Jim Kelly and John Elway in playoff games. ;)

When Marty had Bernie Kosar and end-of-his-career Joe Montana as his QBs, Marty's offensive coordinators winged the ball all over the place. Sadly, it wasn't enough to beat two of the three Hall of Fame QBs in AFC Championship Games- largely due to "the Drive", "The Fumble" and "The Injury".Isn't it strange that Brees is now throwing successful deep passes nearly every game this year? Maybe he got a bionic arm after his surgery. Or maybe, just maybe, he isn't a prisoner to Marty Ball anymore. I don't know, just a possibility.

[StevenSD]

Isn't it strange that Brees is now throwing successful deep passes nearly every game this year? Maybe he got a bionic arm after his surgery. Or maybe, just maybe, he isn't a prisoner to Marty Ball anymore. I don't know, just a possibility.

Lol, I can't wait to see what you say when Marty gets our team a ring.

[JoeMcRugby]

Isn't it strange that Brees is now throwing successful deep passes nearly every game this year? Maybe he got a bionic arm after his surgery. Or maybe, just maybe, he isn't a prisoner to Marty Ball anymore. I don't know, just a possibility.

I've only seen Brees air it out a few times deep this season with receivers wide open - like he did with the Chargers in 2005. I have not seen him challenge teams deep with the DBs anywhere near the WRs - just like with the Chargers in 2005. Most of his passes have been the same as 2005 - spreading it around effectively in the 5 to 15 yard range.

And not having LT (the best running back, leading ground gainer and leader in TDs) on your team tends to make your team less reliant on throwing the ball. Brees has thrown 50 more passes than PR, has 450 more passing yards and has thrown 4 more INTs than PR.

I see very little difference between the Brees of 2005 and the Brees of 2006. In fact, I see very little difference between PR and the Brees of 2006. :confused:

[JCDavey]

Lol, I can't wait to see what you say when Marty gets our team a ring.i'll give you a preview of what i'll say at least ....

ahem......


THANK YOU JESUS! i can now die happy!

[GoTomlinson]

Even if Cam were to call every play it would be after Marty told him to keep the ball on the ground. The head coach has the highest authority on the team. The best head coaches hold themselves accountable no matter who is at fault. The buck stops here!

[JoeMcRugby]

Even if Cam were to call every play it would be after Marty told him to keep the ball on the ground. The head coach has the highest authority on the team. The best head coaches hold themselves accountable no matter who is at fault. The buck stops here!
Did you listen to the interview? :confused:

Cam adamantly said that wasn't the case against the Ravens.

Cam said it was his choice to call every play. If he wanted to call a pass play, Cam said he was free to do so.

It was Cam's choice to keep running the ball because he stated that he became enamored with the Chargers success running the ball in the first half.

Of course, we all know that Cam is lying.

BTW The buck did stop with Marty that day. Did you ever hear Marty blame playcalling on anyone else that ugly Sunday?

Marty took all the heat from fans, local media and national media - and rightfully so. He's the head man.

[Fouts2Chandler]

nice to see cam take that bullet
that's very rivers-ish

or Brees-ish.

[JCDavey]

or Brees-ish.so true :Beer: ...

[FanSince1979]

I've only seen Brees air it out a few times deep this season with receivers wide open - like he did with the Chargers in 2005. I have not seen him challenge teams deep with the DBs anywhere near the WRs - just like with the Chargers in 2005. Most of his passes have been the same as 2005 - spreading it around effectively in the 5 to 15 yard range.

And not having LT (the best running back, leading ground gainer and leader in TDs) on your team tends to make your team less reliant on throwing the ball. Brees has thrown 50 more passes than PR, has 450 more passing yards and has thrown 4 more INTs than PR.

I see very little difference between the Brees of 2005 and the Brees of 2006. In fact, I see very little difference between PR and the Brees of 2006. :confused:I highly recommend DirecTV's NFL Sunday Ticket. I love it! :):Beer:

I'm not sure, but didn't you predict that Eric Parker would be a deep threat now that Rivers was the QB instead of Brees?

[FanSince1979]

Lol, I can't wait to see what you say when Marty gets our team a ring.I'll be thankful that he changed his playoff loser ways, and think to myself: "I said thanks, now don't let the door hit you in the butt on the way out." ;):):Beer:

[TONYD1]

It is very interesting that cam ball would have sit on the ball in the Baltimore game after Phillip Rivers snatched a Indiana Victory away from Cam at Indiana Phillip's freshman year. Down 38-21 Rivers lead a comeback to tie the game and send it to overtime where the wolfpack won.
I think you can see from his play calling he has full confidence in 17 Now.
How ironic Phillip helps get Cam fired at Indiana and he may help him get a head job in the NFL now.