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  #41  
Old 11-16-2012, 11:22 AM
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While OL should probably be the first priority, waiting a year on OLB would be a major mistake. English and Barnes look like non-factors right now, JJ is not a pass rusher, and Phillips is a free agent that we may or may not resign (and he's been average anyways).

Addressing the need at corner before pass rusher is backwards and should only be done if there is a value disparity that can't be ignored.

In the first, Jones is quite good, but I prefer Damontre Moore (Jones' durability concerns me). Mingo is an Aldon Smith type athlete, while Werner and Montgomery are also two to consider.

If we're looking at the second, there are a few good talents who might slip to us as Reyes did this year. Dion Jordan, Alex Okafor, Corey Lemonier, Tank Carradine, and Chase Thomas to name a few.

And if we move to a 4-3, we have no ends. Our current ends (Liuget, Reyes) would be DT's and Ingram would be best off in a Von Miller role. So that move would require a heavy FA investment in true defensive ends (Michael Johnson, Matt Shaughnessy, Dwight Freeney, etc).

My opinion is that this FA/Cap casualty class is screaming for us to sign a veteran corner rather than draft one high. I agree we need two offensive linemen, so I would advocate finding one of them in free agency. Then you are free to at least try to go OL/OLB with your first two picks. That's the course that makes the most sense to me.
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  #42  
Old 11-16-2012, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Kemp17 View Post
While OL should probably be the first priority, waiting a year on OLB would be a major mistake. English and Barnes look like non-factors right now, JJ is not a pass rusher, and Phillips is a free agent that we may or may not resign (and he's been average anyways).

Addressing the need at corner before pass rusher is backwards and should only be done if there is a value disparity that can't be ignored.

In the first, Jones is quite good, but I prefer Damontre Moore (Jones' durability concerns me). Mingo is an Aldon Smith type athlete, while Werner and Montgomery are also two to consider.

If we're looking at the second, there are a few good talents who might slip to us as Reyes did this year. Dion Jordan, Alex Okafor, Corey Lemonier, Tank Carradine, and Chase Thomas to name a few.

And if we move to a 4-3, we have no ends. Our current ends (Liuget, Reyes) would be DT's and Ingram would be best off in a Von Miller role. So that move would require a heavy FA investment in true defensive ends (Michael Johnson, Matt Shaughnessy, Dwight Freeney, etc).

My opinion is that this FA/Cap casualty class is screaming for us to sign a veteran corner rather than draft one high. I agree we need two offensive linemen, so I would advocate finding one of them in free agency. Then you are free to at least try to go OL/OLB with your first two picks. That's the course that makes the most sense to me.
All good points, I would still not rule out Barnes as a starting passrusher. Phillips is better with barnes and should be resigned. I would love to sign a shutdown corner and really focus on building the OL in FA and mostly the draft.

English is done, bust as a first rounder. He is still under rookie contract and should stay on. Cut him in next mini camp if no improvement or health issues.
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  #43  
Old 11-16-2012, 12:30 PM
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Originally Posted by charger1_sj View Post
Moving to a 4/3 may be even more problematic as our current DEs are built for the 3/4 and with the possible exception of Ingram we have no monster type DE that fits the 4/3. We could go Ingram/Reyes but no guarantees of success. The problem is still the same, lack of a monster pass rusher.
Maybe English would do better going back to a 4-3 end? I doubt it - but I can dream.

Last edited by Prae; 11-16-2012 at 12:38 PM..
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  #44  
Old 11-16-2012, 12:34 PM
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Wonder if they don't do that more because Spikes is so terrible in coverage.
I'm sure that's a big part of it, if not all of it.

I just wish that from the nickel package when it's Butler and Demorrio Williams out there that we'd send Butler more often to get pressure up the gut.

One consistent thing you see from GOOD defenses is pressure up the gut and in the QB's face. At this point, we don't have a guy who slides inside who consistently gets pressure in the QB's face from the nickel set. I LOVE what I'm seeing from Liuget and Reyes is flashing promise, but I still think we lack pressure to collapse the pocket. That makes the job of guys who are speed rushers next to impossible. If the QB gets to step up as far as he wants, the edge guys won't ever get there.
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  #45  
Old 11-16-2012, 12:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Kemp17 View Post
While OL should probably be the first priority, waiting a year on OLB would be a major mistake. English and Barnes look like non-factors right now, JJ is not a pass rusher, and Phillips is a free agent that we may or may not resign (and he's been average anyways).

Addressing the need at corner before pass rusher is backwards and should only be done if there is a value disparity that can't be ignored.

In the first, Jones is quite good, but I prefer Damontre Moore (Jones' durability concerns me). Mingo is an Aldon Smith type athlete, while Werner and Montgomery are also two to consider.

If we're looking at the second, there are a few good talents who might slip to us as Reyes did this year. Dion Jordan, Alex Okafor, Corey Lemonier, Tank Carradine, and Chase Thomas to name a few.

And if we move to a 4-3, we have no ends. Our current ends (Liuget, Reyes) would be DT's and Ingram would be best off in a Von Miller role. So that move would require a heavy FA investment in true defensive ends (Michael Johnson, Matt Shaughnessy, Dwight Freeney, etc).

My opinion is that this FA/Cap casualty class is screaming for us to sign a veteran corner rather than draft one high. I agree we need two offensive linemen, so I would advocate finding one of them in free agency. Then you are free to at least try to go OL/OLB with your first two picks. That's the course that makes the most sense to me.
I think it's only prudent to draft a front 7 guy EVERY draft. Now- that could be an early pick(s) like Ingram and Reyes, or other years, it could be that freakish athlete guy who may have a smaller resume, but your scouts think he has the skill set to grow.

Either way, I think you HAVE to keep the cupboard stocked in the front 7.
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  #46  
Old 11-16-2012, 12:37 PM
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How high do we need to pick to get them though?

Without the premier QB's at the top to push them down they will probably be gone.
I was thinking the same thing this morning. There probably won't be 4-5 QB's selected in round 1 this year- that's going to make the OT's, OLB's, etc., fly off the board early.

This doesn't seem to be an ideal year to have a mid-round pick if you're looking for talent at a non-QB position.
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  #47  
Old 11-16-2012, 12:37 PM
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Originally Posted by kiwibolt View Post
I'm sure that's a big part of it, if not all of it.

I just wish that from the nickel package when it's Butler and Demorrio Williams out there that we'd send Butler more often to get pressure up the gut.

One consistent thing you see from GOOD defenses is pressure up the gut and in the QB's face. At this point, we don't have a guy who slides inside who consistently gets pressure in the QB's face from the nickel set. I LOVE what I'm seeing from Liuget and Reyes is flashing promise, but I still think we lack pressure to collapse the pocket. That makes the job of guys who are speed rushers next to impossible. If the QB gets to step up as far as he wants, the edge guys won't ever get there.
Agreed, dilemma here is that Butler is also awesome in coverage (imo).

Need a yin to his yang (or vice versa)
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  #48  
Old 11-16-2012, 12:52 PM
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Originally Posted by florida SD fan View Post
All good points, I would still not rule out Barnes as a starting passrusher. Phillips is better with barnes and should be resigned. I would love to sign a shutdown corner and really focus on building the OL in FA and mostly the draft.

English is done, bust as a first rounder. He is still under rookie contract and should stay on. Cut him in next mini camp if no improvement or health issues.
Barnes is having his worst year by far out of the three that he's been a Charger. I can't see how he would become a starter now after failing to do so when he was actually playing well.
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  #49  
Old 11-16-2012, 12:54 PM
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I just wish that from the nickel package when it's Butler and Demorrio Williams out there that we'd send Butler more often to get pressure up the gut.
Norval does enough "up the gut stuff" on offense. It's the offenses job to pound the gut.


Quote:
One consistent thing you see from GOOD defenses is pressure up the gut and in the QB's face.
Hence why Norvals running game doesn't work. It's all "up the gut" against good defenses who send pressure right at it.
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  #50  
Old 11-16-2012, 01:09 PM
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Originally Posted by pacstud22 View Post
Agreed, dilemma here is that Butler is also awesome in coverage (imo).

Need a yin to his yang (or vice versa)
Really disappointed Mouton can't break onto the field.
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