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View Full Version : Who would you like to see the Bolts pick in Round One?


Chargeroo
12-31-2004, 11:25 AM
This new area is for discussion of draft picks. I have mixed emotions over which position they should seek help in the most. Some think we need a new WR the most, others want a great pass rusher, still others say get a Safety. What do you think?

raiderhater1
12-31-2004, 11:43 AM
i think we need somebody in oyr secondary>>>> our front seven though not a great pass rusher put the run game has been shut down all season and our sec.. is suspect and a saftey that is physical would be a great asset to this team next year.

Rip
12-31-2004, 11:44 AM
Derrick Johnson
Antrell Rolle
Mike Williams
Braylon Edwards
Anttaj Hawthorne
Marcus Spears
Thomas Davis


In that order

raiderhater1
12-31-2004, 11:45 AM
Hawthorne will not be around that late rip....he will go end of 2nd first of 3rd round

GoMathews
12-31-2004, 11:57 AM
Derrick Johnson or Antrel Rolle, then a defensive end or offensive tackle with the other first round pick.

powderblue
12-31-2004, 11:58 AM
matt shelton out of notre dame who averages over 30 yards a catch. or that defensive lineman from georgia.

Rip
12-31-2004, 11:58 AM
Originally posted by: raiderhater1
Hawthorne will not be around that late rip....he will go end of 2nd first of 3rd round

That would be a huge mistake, he is he best DL in the draft

raiderhater1
12-31-2004, 12:03 PM
i wouldnt say the best dl but he is top 3 but very very good quick and strong big guy>>>>trust me i wouldnt mind having him my self but i dont think hell be there on our forth pick

RMANCIL
12-31-2004, 12:07 PM
Originally posted by: raiderhater1
Hawthorne will not be around that late rip....he will go end of 2nd first of 3rd round


He should be drafted round one unless he is a wife beater,arrested for selling drugs and facing prison time for tax evasion and even then late second round for sure.
i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif

boltz21forlife
12-31-2004, 12:08 PM
I say we use one of our first round picks on a big run-stuffing DE (like Olshansky), due to the fact that the 3-4 is key to having strong bodies up front to free the linebackers up, and because you can always rotate d-lineman and you can never have enough of them. With our second first round pick I say we go after a playmaking linebacker with good size and speed. I would have said safety, but has anyone checked out this year's safety class! I mean the first safety taken could possibly be as late as the 3rd round.

raiderhater1
12-31-2004, 12:11 PM
i agree rman but i just dont see him there on our forth pick as rip was saying i dont see him in the top 20 picks but like i said in the sec somewhere!!!

chiefmoran
12-31-2004, 12:37 PM
first 1. rolle and second 1. arasmus james

RMANCIL
12-31-2004, 12:39 PM
Originally posted by: boltz21forlife
I say we use one of our first round picks on a big run-stuffing DE (like Olshansky), due to the fact that the 3-4 is key to having strong bodies up front to free the linebackers up, and because you can always rotate d-lineman and you can never have enough of them. With our second first round pick I say we go after a playmaking linebacker with good size and speed. I would have said safety, but has anyone checked out this year's safety class! I mean the first safety taken could possibly be as late as the 3rd round.


Sounds good the key is to find that player with the talent level to match our draft position. Another words we don't want to reach to fill a need. The club with the first pick if they want a DL will look to trade back a little as it looks like the Giants selection http://www.gbnreport.com/weeklydraftorder.htm will be between 14 -4 round one. At this time no DL rate in the top 10 at least not a DL to play in the 3-4 defense.

The other issue is the fact that as more under classmen drop out and if the top QB's stay in school it will be hard for team's to trade down.

The talent of a player at 14 may be on par with 5 in round 1. However their contracts won't be.

Smith will take the B.A. first and all things equal the position will fall into second and in the long run the club will benefit in fact with the depth and age the only area of huge concern is OL where Oben is long of tooth and the Bolts don't have a proven player to step up if needed.

RMANCIL
12-31-2004, 12:43 PM
Originally posted by: raiderhater1
i agree rman but i just dont see him there on our forth pick as rip was saying i dont see him in the top 20 picks but like i said in the sec somewhere!!!

Until the combine I am not sure if he is in the top 20 but he could be. His size and quickness is bigtime and their isn't a lot of talent at this position. He looks like a first rounder for sure to me.

RMANCIL
12-31-2004, 12:47 PM
Originally posted by: boltz21forlife
I say we use one of our first round picks on a big run-stuffing DE (like Olshansky), due to the fact that the 3-4 is key to having strong bodies up front to free the linebackers up, and because you can always rotate d-lineman and you can never have enough of them. With our second first round pick I say we go after a playmaking linebacker with good size and speed. I would have said safety, but has anyone checked out this year's safety class! I mean the first safety taken could possibly be as late as the 3rd round.

I like the safties and I think you will see several in the top two rounds.


1 Ernest Shazor, Michigan S
2 Thomas Davis, Georgia S
3 Marlin Jackson, Michigan CB/S
4 Donte Nicholson, Oklahoma S
5 James Butler, Georgia Tech S

Are all players who should if they come out be drafted in the top two rounds.

2ANGELES7
12-31-2004, 12:48 PM
I think we should aim to get a WR and a D-line man in the draft.. Braylon Edwards or Marcus Spears, i think they would a great addition to our team..

We sould look for a safety in FA, a vet to lead our secondary.

guimcharger
12-31-2004, 01:03 PM
A pass rushing DE and Big MLB to be groomed behind Donnie Edwards and Randal Godfrey. The LB situation is assuming they let go of Moreno.

WARHAWKS
12-31-2004, 01:43 PM
we need pass rushing DE that may replace Casieres.

god our team seem so perfect. we have parker, mcCardwell, Osgood, Caldwell, Dwight, i dont see why we need wide reciever casue parker, caldwell, and osgood seem rising to be star cause they pretty good wide receivers. we have good offensive linemen

hey i suggest why not we draft fullback cause our Neal is great but he is old vetern u know? 12 years like that.

our secondry seem rising florence and jammer seem rising getting better also i like davis seem rising too. we dont need to replace them casue we have davis, flecter, and pippin aviable for them.

i guess we will replace wilson for milliagn or hart and i dont see that we need to draft safty casue milliagn and hart and kiel is wonderful saftey.

tight end is fine

quarterback is fine

running back is fine of course

wide recievers is good enough to step up to be best player

secondry seem got better by not allowing passing touchdown pass few games

all we need to draft two good linebackers to backup for Edward and Godfery u know they play hard but they can retire next two years or next year.

also i really trust with DE next year casue i think Dave Ball and Shaun Phillip will be good smashing speedy pass rusher and run stoping run. i suggest why not next year the starter is from left DE to right DE is Phillip William Igor (when 3rd down it BAll to replace either phillip or igor)

our linebacker seem fine but draft 1 or 2 linbackers to back up for gofrey and edward also dont forgot our good linebacker Polk, Carlos he can be like Foley.

man i feel like i should be person who draft the players.

WARHAWKS
12-31-2004, 02:05 PM
also if oben retire next year then we have rookie draft named Carlos Joseph can do it next year as starter well i have seen he he pretty good but he can be like olivea and rest of others offensive linemen also our offenisve coach can teach him tons things and he success a lot of underdogs offensive linemen. i trust him that eh can be starter next year which i belive that 12 years vetern oben (i love him so much) will retire next year i think i dunno it his chocie.

also Ryon Bingham doing pretty good with igor and william during the game also i like him along with igor and william.

RollinThunder
12-31-2004, 02:40 PM
With our first pick we need to find a big DE the likes of Igor - at 6'5" 315 Roderique Wright fits the mold best, also he is a natural DT so he could also be looked at to spell Jamal Williams. If Wright is gone, we grab Marcus Spears, a natural DE and only slightly smaller at 6'4" 295. With our second pick we should look to take the best available LT - assuming Jamal Brown and Alex Barron are gone, maybe Marcus McNeill 6'8" 340 or Jon Scott 6'7" 305.

WARHAWKS
12-31-2004, 03:09 PM
but we have Burner (Michael Turner) to backup for LT same with Chatman...why draft other running back?

WARHAWKS
12-31-2004, 03:12 PM
also if goff retires then olivea have ability to be guard he can back him up and if oben reitre then Joseph can take care of that along VanBuren take olivea spot. i dunno

can u tell me which website to find every player will be in 2005 draft information. which website is that? then i will look up and do some research for next year future

WARHAWKS
12-31-2004, 03:23 PM
i just like to talking abouut chargers future and i will like to join chargers u know set up next year deph chart

Huskerboy
12-31-2004, 04:41 PM
I think we need a Rush end, and a wide reciever. It's a tall order on getting these two in the draft.
Rush End opposite of Igor - Erastus James
Wide reciever - Mike Williams
Being that far under the salary cap we could find better help at linebacker in free agency. There's a lot of Steve Foleys out there that aren't being used to their strengths.
And at Safety, You could grab a good one in the second round, there is a bunch them out there this year

guimcharger
12-31-2004, 04:56 PM
No more WR. McCardell, Parker, Caldwell, Osgood, and Floyd are all capable. Plus Osgood has some real potential if he could get in the starting line up.

geekster
12-31-2004, 04:57 PM
Originally posted by: Rip

Originally posted by: raiderhater1
Hawthorne will not be around that late rip....he will go end of 2nd first of 3rd round

That would be a huge mistake, he is he best DL in the draft

Let us not forget - with 2 No. 1 draft choices - AJ is also in a perfect position to trade up in this draft and get just about anybody he wants after the first 2 are gone... I'm a bit surprised that point - "trading up" hasn't been discussed here a bit more than it has.

Like AJ says - "we will have a lot of options to look at"....

Personally I would like to see us come away from the first round with either Mike Williams, WR, USC or Erasmus James, DE, Wisconsin... (Of course - mileage may vary between now and draft day. i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif )...

Chargeroo
12-31-2004, 07:26 PM
Originally posted by: guimcharger
No more WR. McCardell, Parker, Caldwell, Osgood, and Floyd are all capable. Plus Osgood has some real potential if he could get in the starting line up.
How do you know Floyd is "capable"? We haven't seen him make even one catch yet. I'd have no problem with them taking a WR. Remember that WR's usually take a couple of years to start producing. Taking one this time could keep us going when McCardell retires.

IronMountain1960
12-31-2004, 07:36 PM
We do not have a true #1 receiver, so that would be my 1st pick, hopefully Mike Williams, the other, later 1st round pick would be either a pass rushing DE, or another OLT, Oben is starting to get old, and we need a replacement in the future.

Chargeroo
12-31-2004, 09:17 PM
I wonder about CVB? Will he be okay after his injury heals or is it a career ending type of injury? If he's okay to go for next year that would put a little different slant on how they draft. I could see them waiting until the fourth or fifth rounds for a OT is CVB is okay, if not they may take one in the late first or the second round.

Shamrock
12-31-2004, 11:41 PM
Right now, I haven't seen enough of the draftable players, or read and watched as much college football as I usually do. I guess I'll have to get caught up when the draft shows and periodicals are published.

From what I've seen, these are guys I've got some thoughts on:

Derrick Johnson - He's the best player I've seen this year. He's too light to play ILB in the NFL, and too light for OLB as well. He would need to add 15-20 lbs of bulk to fit in to OLB in the 3-4, and he would need to retain his quickness. He is a playmaker. If he's available, you have to take this guy. Add the weight later, because this dude is going to be a star.

Braylon Edwards - I've only seen part of one Michigan game, but this kid is smooth. I've seen a lot of his highlights, and I can't wait to see the breakdowns on his strengths and weaknesses on the draft shows, but he might be better than Fitzgerald from last year's draft.

Erasmus James - This kid is the fastest DE off the edge I've seen in a long time. He is too light for DE in a 3-4. Can he bulk up and still play at that speed? Probably best suited for the 4-3, but he looks like a faster Freeney, and Freeney is fast.

Antrell Rolle - When I saw him in the opener vs. Florida State, I thought he was the best player on the field. When I watched the Miami vs. Louisville game, I didn't think this kid was more than a late 2nd round pick. His cover skills were less than adequate, and his physicality was lacking. He also got involved in extra "skirmishes" and smack talking. I don't think this kid is an AJ type player.

Mike Williams - Speed, or lack there of. He'll be on the board after the middle of the first round. Everyone will wet themselves wondering why. Speed, or lack there of.

I haven't seen enough of either DL named Cody to make any judgements on them.

IronMountain1960
01-01-2005, 10:52 AM
Originally posted by: Shamrock

Mike Williams - Speed, or lack there of. He'll be on the board after the middle of the first round. Everyone will wet themselves wondering why. Speed, or lack there of.

I haven't seen enough of either DL named Cody to make any judgements on them.

I like both Codys, however Williams is bigger, stronger and faster than anybody thinks, he is a lot like TO to me, without the jackass personality. Williams run great routes, is really quick out of his breaks, and has the best hands I've ever seen on a wide receiver, three guys go up for the ball and Williams will be the guy who catches it. I am praying he falls down to the Giants pick, if we trade Bree, Rivers will need a true #1, and we don't have one. We do have 2 very good #2 receivers in Parker and McCardell, and a great #3 in Osgood, and if you like the offense to click on all cylinders then watch what we would have with Williams, McCardell, Gates, LT, and Osgood.i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif I feel like we can get the D help with our 1st and 2nd.

Chargeroo
01-01-2005, 02:49 PM
The Mike Williams I saw did not run great routes. He rounded off his corners and seemed to pretty slip shod in his route running. He does have great hands and size. If they pick a WR, I think it should be a number one type guy and in this draft, that;s Braylon Edwards. To me Williams is a great possession receiver but that's what all of our WR's are. I'd love to have Williams when were on the ten yard line though - imagine him and Gates and Osgood in the end zone playing "jump ball" with the standard 5'10'' Cornerback. However, Edwards is a #1 type WR and we could use that great deep threat that Edwards has. I'm not opposed to Williams but I just don't think he's a guy that fits this team as well as Edwards.

Rip
01-01-2005, 03:29 PM
Why do people complain about williams speed? Sure he isnt a burner, but you dont have to be to be a succesful WR in the NFL.

If you look at the past 2 drafts, can anyone tell the most productive WR from each one?

Anquan Boldin (2003) 101 catches for 1377 yards and 8 TD's
Micheal Clayton (2004) 78 catches for 1107 yards amd 6 TD's

And the biggest knock on both of them was their speed. Boldin ran a 4.75!! and Clayton ran a 4.6. But much like williams both are big and have great hands

ftwbolt
01-01-2005, 04:13 PM
Originally posted by: Chargeroo
This new area is for discussion of draft picks. I have mixed emotions over which position they should seek help in the most. Some think we need a new WR the most, others want a great pass rusher, still others say get a Safety. What do you think?

Having 2 first round picks afords the Bolts of filling two position's above, as long as they are not reaches. If A.J. and Marty are not happy with Milligan, taking a look at a Saftey in the second round maybe an option.

ftwbolt
01-01-2005, 05:04 PM
Originally posted by: guimcharger
No more WR. McCardell, Parker, Caldwell, Osgood, and Floyd are all capable. Plus Osgood has some real potential if he could get in the starting line up.

First off- how much longer is McCardell going to play ? he's about to turn 35 yr's old.
Parker, Caldwell,and Dwight- who cannot be depended on to stay healthy, are #2 and #3 WR's
Osgood is a solid #3, but he does'nt get on the field enough.

If Osgood would only get more PT and more involved in the Offense, my personal opinion he could very well be the Chargers version of Mike Williams, a possesion receiver.

Dont get me wrong, I like Williams, but if they were there and I had a choice, it would be B. Edwards over Williams.

Floyd maybe capable, but he is not had much PT, nor will he in the Playoff's, unless sombody gets hurt.

Huskerboy
01-01-2005, 05:59 PM
After watching Georgia, and Wisconsin, I've changed my mine on our 1st round picks.
Pollack is unreal. I could see that guy fitting into the system right away. I'm convinced that linebackers are more important than down lineman, in our system. Igor, and a host of others can secure the tackle spots, and Jamal is Jamal.
Before today I thinking Mike Williams for the other 1st rounder.... I've changed my mind. Edwards of Michigan is more of a stand out. He ripped Texas on a few occasions today. I think he would be an all pro punt and/or kickoff returner as well.
Anyway watching the bowl games this year, makes me realize that the draft is deep, and the talent is well distributed. No matter who the Bolts take.

IronMountain1960
01-01-2005, 06:42 PM
For not running great routes, Williams was always getting open, so he had to be doing something pretty good. I have watched him coming out of breaks and he is very quick for such a big guy. I like Edwards also, and Pollack sure is fast enough to be a great LB, he reminds me of Phillips in the way he goes for the QB. I would be very happy to get either WR and Pollack in the first, but they should all be gone by the mid first round.

HeadTrip
01-01-2005, 08:03 PM
Originally posted by: IronMountain
For not running great routes, Williams was always getting open, so he had to be doing something pretty good. I have watched him coming out of breaks and he is very quick for such a big guy. I like Edwards also, and Pollack sure is fast enough to be a great LB, he reminds me of Phillips in the way he goes for the QB. I would be very happy to get either WR and Pollack in the first, but they should all be gone by the mid first round.

Good thing we have the Giants pick whihc will most likely be in the 5-10 range then i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif.

Since I dont watch any college football im not really in a position to judge who we should get. I think our most glaring need is at FS, and after that we need an end opposite Igor. I do think we need a WR as well. Reche really started to blossom, EP is a solid #2 timmy D is a fair reciever as well, Kmac is good but old, however they have all had injury problems(besides Kmac). We could use a stud to 1) upgrade talent 2) be deeper at WR. We cannot depend on these guys to be around all the time and that is why a receiver is needed.

Shamrock
01-01-2005, 08:27 PM
Originally posted by: Shamrock
From what I've seen, these are guys I've got some thoughts on:

Derrick Johnson - He's the best player I've seen this year. He's too light to play ILB in the NFL, and too light for OLB as well. He would need to add 15-20 lbs of bulk to fit in to OLB in the 3-4, and he would need to retain his quickness. He is a playmaker. If he's available, you have to take this guy. Add the weight later, because this dude is going to be a star.

Braylon Edwards - I've only seen part of one Michigan game, but this kid is smooth. I've seen a lot of his highlights, and I can't wait to see the breakdowns on his strengths and weaknesses on the draft shows, but he might be better than Fitzgerald from last year's draft.

Erasmus James - This kid is the fastest DE off the edge I've seen in a long time. He is too light for DE in a 3-4. Can he bulk up and still play at that speed? Probably best suited for the 4-3, but he looks like a faster Freeney, and Freeney is fast.

I'm quoting myself because I want to add a few things after these three players bowl games.

E. James - I didn't watch Wisconsin, but from what a few friends told me, they thought he was MIA for most of the game. His speed also seemed like it wasn't there. I know he had an injury earlier this season, and maybe he hasn't recovered yet???

D. Johnson - MIA is the exact term to describe his play in the Rose Bowl. I had to ask my Buddy if he even suited up. He was invisible. I saw games earlier this season where he flew to the ball on every play. Star players can not be a no show in a New Year's Day bowl game. I've fallen off his bandwagon.

B. Edwards - His first TD was a "body catch." Most NFL CB's would have knocked that ball away. Elite WR's go up and snatch the ball at its highest point. Twice I saw "alligator arms" on plays across the middle to Edwards. His routes aren't nearly as smooth as I previously thought. This is a VERY talented kid, but he has some things to work on when he gets to the NFL.

IronMountain1960
01-01-2005, 08:41 PM
Originally posted by: HeadTrip

Originally posted by: IronMountain
For not running great routes, Williams was always getting open, so he had to be doing something pretty good. I have watched him coming out of breaks and he is very quick for such a big guy. I like Edwards also, and Pollack sure is fast enough to be a great LB, he reminds me of Phillips in the way he goes for the QB. I would be very happy to get either WR and Pollack in the first, but they should all be gone by the mid first round.

Good thing we have the Giants pick whihc will most likely be in the 5-10 range then .

Since I dont watch any college football im not really in a position to judge who we should get. I think our most glaring need is at FS, and after that we need an end opposite Igor. I do think we need a WR as well. Reche really started to blossom, EP is a solid #2 timmy D is a fair reciever as well, Kmac is good but old, however they have all had injury problems(besides Kmac). We could use a stud to 1) upgrade talent 2) be deeper at WR. We cannot depend on these guys to be around all the time and that is why a receiver is needed.
I wonder how Reche is doing with healing his knee, I have heard nothing on his recuperation, he sure turned it up a couple of notches this year, I couldn't believe the improvement on catching the ball from last year to this year.

ftwbolt
01-01-2005, 09:30 PM
[quote]
Originally posted by: Shamrock
[quote]
Originally posted by: Shamrock
From what I've seen, these are guys I've got some thoughts on:




I'm quoting myself because I want to add a few things after these three players bowl games.

E. James - I didn't watch Wisconsin, but from what a few friends told me, they thought he was MIA for most of the game. His speed also seemed like it wasn't there. I know he had an injury earlier this season, and maybe he hasn't recovered yet???
--------------------------------------------------------------



One note that I forgot to mention, that the play by play guy's brought up. Was'nt aware of this untill they brought it up, But E. James has had a hip injury.Dont know if that will hurt his draft status.

guimcharger
01-01-2005, 10:33 PM
Originally posted by: Chargeroo

Originally posted by: guimcharger
No more WR. McCardell, Parker, Caldwell, Osgood, and Floyd are all capable. Plus Osgood has some real potential if he could get in the starting line up.
How do you know Floyd is "capable"? We haven't seen him make even one catch yet. I'd have no problem with them taking a WR. Remember that WR's usually take a couple of years to start producing. Taking one this time could keep us going when McCardell retires.

Floyd 6-6 220 pounds. Wasn't drafted because his 40 time was a little too slow. He was a deep threat a Wyoming a could be here if given the opportunity. We will see tomorrow at the chiefs game.

boltz21forlife
01-01-2005, 10:58 PM
Originally posted by RMANCIL:
I like the safties and I think you will see several in the top two rounds.


1 Ernest Shazor, Michigan S
2 Thomas Davis, Georgia S
3 Marlin Jackson, Michigan CB/S
4 Donte Nicholson, Oklahoma S
5 James Butler, Georgia Tech S

Are all players who should if they come out be drafted in the top two rounds.






You are right, I forgot about Shazor, this guy is a very good safety. I could see San Diego using this kid. I also like Butler out of Georgia Tech.

Boltjolt
01-02-2005, 01:07 AM
Originally posted by: Shamrock

Originally posted by: Shamrock
From what I've seen, these are guys I've got some thoughts on:

Derrick Johnson - He's the best player I've seen this year. He's too light to play ILB in the NFL, and too light for OLB as well. He would need to add 15-20 lbs of bulk to fit in to OLB in the 3-4, and he would need to retain his quickness. He is a playmaker. If he's available, you have to take this guy. Add the weight later, because this dude is going to be a star.

Braylon Edwards - I've only seen part of one Michigan game, but this kid is smooth. I've seen a lot of his highlights, and I can't wait to see the breakdowns on his strengths and weaknesses on the draft shows, but he might be better than Fitzgerald from last year's draft.

Erasmus James - This kid is the fastest DE off the edge I've seen in a long time. He is too light for DE in a 3-4. Can he bulk up and still play at that speed? Probably best suited for the 4-3, but he looks like a faster Freeney, and Freeney is fast.

I'm quoting myself because I want to add a few things after these three players bowl games.

E. James - I didn't watch Wisconsin, but from what a few friends told me, they thought he was MIA for most of the game. His speed also seemed like it wasn't there. I know he had an injury earlier this season, and maybe he hasn't recovered yet???

D. Johnson - MIA is the exact term to describe his play in the Rose Bowl. I had to ask my Buddy if he even suited up. He was invisible. I saw games earlier this season where he flew to the ball on every play. Star players can not be a no show in a New Year's Day bowl game. I've fallen off his bandwagon.

B. Edwards - His first TD was a "body catch." Most NFL CB's would have knocked that ball away. Elite WR's go up and snatch the ball at its highest point. Twice I saw "alligator arms" on plays across the middle to Edwards. His routes aren't nearly as smooth as I previously thought. This is a VERY talented kid, but he has some things to work on when he gets to the NFL.


Dont agree on a few points.

First..Derrick Johnson seemed to be keyed on a lot with extra blockers so he couldnt beat them and forcing other guys to make plays. You cant judge him by one game. The guy had a tremendous year. He would have been a top 15 pick last year. Dude had 9 forced fumbles on the year counting the one he had tonight.

Edwards...he dropped one pass. Others thrown to him that he didnt catch were crappy passes. Sure he has things to work on but what college player doesnt that enters the NFL? He is going to be a stud in the NFL. He is the 3rd strongest guy on the team , is a great leaper and has good speed and is an excellent blocker. Whats not to like?

James... he isnt going to be on this team in a 3-4 weighing only 260.


I do like Pollack. He has some decent size at 280 lbs. He could add 10 more easy and be a DE in a 3-4. He wont be a LB on this team which i saw somebody say.



IMO with our first pick the players i think are worth that pick in the top 10(in order) are Derrick Johnson(who could also possibly play SS)...who i would take first if he were there,
if not id take either Braylon Edwards or even Mike Williams(Edwards first if he was there).
But if we get DJ id like to get Mark Clayton with the 2nd first round pick. We have two WR's that are 6'5" for those red zone jump balls.
Then in the 2nd get a DE like Chris Canty.

There are a lot of players being mentioned on this thread that are reported to not be declaring for this draft. This draft is potentualy going to be weak.

GamblerLT5
01-02-2005, 01:45 AM
With the first pick I'd like Johnson, Mike Williams or Antrel Rolle if its top 10, if its higher than 10 then Ahmad Brooks or Pac-Man Jones (CB/S in my opinion)

RMANCIL
01-02-2005, 07:29 AM
Edwards had a great game yesterday. In addition to catching several T.D. out leaping two defenders for a long ball and catching it with his hands he had a least one de cleteor on a sweep. The de cleteor was on a LB by the way. I was not in his camp at the beginning of the year I am now.

Williams is a star WR and let me assure you no one is running 4.4 in the 4th qt in the N.F.L. and after week 5 no one is doing it in the second qt. If a player can run constant as the season wears on he will appear faster. Bigger stronger players do this. Jerry Rice did this, Gates does it, ever notice how some players make plays over and over?
Williams and Edwards fall into that category. Edwards is faster than Williams and now has one more season of experience on him as well and if both were on the draft board I would select Edwards for that reason . That said I would love to have either one.

D.J. is so fast and he has good size and is another playmaker. He got taken out of his game yesterday as the Long Horns ran at him in the second half negating his speed. Did you notice how QB Young got faster as the game went on ? D.J. played inside the DE and got caught in the wash he did strip the ball one time in the second half stopping Texas from scoring which they seemed to do on every possession in the second half.

Michigan offense lacked a big time RB eat up the clock and their defense wore out.

ftwbolt
01-02-2005, 08:22 AM
Originally posted by: guimcharger

Originally posted by: Chargeroo

Originally posted by: guimcharger
No more WR. McCardell, Parker, Caldwell, Osgood, and Floyd are all capable. Plus Osgood has some real potential if he could get in the starting line up.
How do you know Floyd is "capable"? We haven't seen him make even one catch yet. I'd have no problem with them taking a WR. Remember that WR's usually take a couple of years to start producing. Taking one this time could keep us going when McCardell retires.

Floyd 6-6 220 pounds. Wasn't drafted because his 40 time was a little too slow. He was a deep threat a Wyoming a could be here if given the opportunity. We will see tomorrow at the chiefs game.

If Floyd is capable and has hands like Osgood, mix Gates into that. Then the Bolt's have three weapons that can move the chains.But they still do not have that #1 deep threat.

crazyman33
01-02-2005, 12:27 PM
Everyone needs to stop sayin mike williams is not fast enough. look at the last 2 rookie receivers who have torn up the leauge. Anquan boldin was ripped for only runnin a 4.8 or whatever and look what he did (101 catches for over 1300 yards). This year michael clayton in tampa is makin cbs look like little kids and he too does not run a 4.4 or whatever.

Mike williams has the size and the hands and he perfroms in the clutch. Thats exactly what clayton and boldin do.

crazyman33
01-02-2005, 12:49 PM
The chargers are solid at most positions so IMO they need to take the best player available when they draft.

Guys i like:
derrick Johnson: the guy is a beast. U say hes to small. hes 6'4 so he can easily get in the weight room. also, donnie edwards is only 227 and hes gonna end the season as the nfl's leader in tackles. DJ won the butkus award which is given to the best linebacker. He also set an NCAA season record with 9 forced fumbles. I love the way he pops the ball out. The chargers have good linebackers, but with a 3-4, u can never have enough. he could start next year at outside backer or they could move him inside. And he would get a lot of grooming from donnie and the run-stopping godfrey. DJ is also a great blitzer.

Mike Williams: hasnt played in a year but the guy is simply a beast. I remember watchin sportscenter and just seein the highlights of his catches.. Everytime they needed a big play, he made one. Hes not amazingly fast but the chargers already have small fast guys. Imagine the dominace in the redzone they could have with mike williams and big antonio gates and maybe even osgood.

Braylon edwards: i used to not like his attitude but i guessed its changed. Hes such a great athlete and has made some terrific catches this year. He had 3 td catches yesterday, a rose bowl record. Both him and mike williams will come in and have great rookie campaigns IMO.

David Pollack: this guy is a monster. He too is labeled as too small but i just love the way this guy plays. Never count him out of a play. Hes always giving 110%. And did u see that play yesterday where he sacked the wisconsin QB and ended up with the ball as well. chargers might be able to get him with their second 1st round pick.

If the chargers dont take edwards or williams then i believe they should go all out for defensive players. They have a good defense now but imagine a dominating ravens/steelers like defense plus a top 5 offense that we already have.

banzai
01-02-2005, 10:28 PM
Thanks to Eli and the Giants we went from the 6th pick in the draft to the 12th pick.judging from the players available at this time the impact players at the positions the Chargers could use.There won't be any impact players available...No Mike Williams,No Braylon Edwards,No Antrell Rolle,None of the talented offensive lineman.If we had the 6th pick we had a good shot at one of the impact players being available.This is a real weak drat talent wise.It may be best to trade both #1 picks for either more picks or a #1 next year.What a sour note to end a playoff year...thanks to the mannings againi/expressions/beer.gifi/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gifi/expressions/SDG_Bolt.gif

banzai
01-02-2005, 10:33 PM
Kiss those players goodbye...thanks to Eli

foty89
01-03-2005, 01:33 AM
I think that most of the emphasis of this draft should be placed on defense. Certainly the higher round picks. I do think that we should get some offensive line help, but we seem to do fine finding those in later rounds. I see no need for any more receivers. And I am also tired of hearing about not having a number one receiver. Tell me who on the Patriots is a number one receiver? They have one two of the last three Super Bowls. If you have a solid group of receivers, as we do, along with good tight ends, as we do, and L.T., as we do, you don't really need that number one guy. You are going to spread the field out enough with what we have to almost always have an option. If A.J. does go for a receiver in the fist, than I'll take Edwards. I am not at all sold on Williams and just have a bad feeling about him.

Whatever we do, it is all good. We have a solid team now and it is only going to get better.

Go Bolts!
i/expressions/SDG_Bolt.gif i/expressions/SDG_Bolt.gif i/expressions/SDG_Bolt.gif

LT4mayor
01-03-2005, 03:53 AM
We defininitely need to go after a safety...jerry wilson is just a touch to slow...we all need to admit that our bigest mistake was getting rid of "Hot Rod" but oh well...if there is nobody worth taking in that position that high, then i say we go after a big play reciever, because who knows whats going to happen with Keenan. Also we saw how many rookie recievers stepped up this year

ftwbolt
01-03-2005, 06:56 AM
Originally posted by: banzai
Thanks to Eli and the Giants we went from the 6th pick in the draft to the 12th pick.judging from the players available at this time the impact players at the positions the Chargers could use.There won't be any impact players available...No Mike Williams,No Braylon Edwards,No Antrell Rolle,None of the talented offensive lineman.If we had the 6th pick we had a good shot at one of the impact players being available.This is a real weak drat talent wise.It may be best to trade both #1 picks for either more picks or a #1 next year.What a sour note to end a playoff year...thanks to the mannings again

Look at this way, SHe may have saved the Bolts some money.
At the 12 pick, they are still going to get a real good player, or package the 2 first round picks and move up and get the player they want.
They have a lot of options.

Chargeroo
01-03-2005, 08:23 AM
With what Caldwell showed before his injury and what Floyd showed in the final game I doubt the Bolts would take a WR in the first round now. I think they'll be looking for a good DE or DT with the first pick of the first round and a Safety with the second pick. They could grab a tweener that's been playing DE in college but is capable of moving to LB in the NFL. They have some solid starters and some good depth, this years rookies will find it difficult to make the team.

Shamrock
01-03-2005, 12:09 PM
I don't want a tweener that is a DE/OLB.

Find a tweener who is DT/DE. We need a bookend for Igor, one who can stop the run, demand double teams to free up rushing LB's, and get a good push in the pass rush.

robanalog
01-03-2005, 12:55 PM
Originally posted by: LT4mayor
We defininitely need to go after a safety...jerry wilson is just a touch to slow...we all need to admit that our bigest mistake was getting rid of "Hot Rod" but oh well...if there is nobody worth taking in that position that high, then i say we go after a big play reciever, because who knows whats going to happen with Keenan. Also we saw how many rookie recievers stepped up this year

We haven't yet seen what Clinton Hart can do...for the games he's been in, he's been close to a few Int's. I'd like to see him replace Wilson next year.
Let's see what we can do with the Dline in the draft...

Sarris
01-03-2005, 02:04 PM
No we are fine up front considering we were 2nd in rushing defense. We need people in the back. I think we went 27th in passing defense and that is what killed us in our losses!

HellsBells
01-03-2005, 03:50 PM
SS or FS with Giants pick, WR or D-Line with our 1st pick.

WrayLaw
01-03-2005, 07:44 PM
Originally posted by: Shamrock
I don't want a tweener that is a DE/OLB.

Find a tweener who is DT/DE. We need a bookend for Igor, one who can stop the run, demand double teams to free up rushing LB's, and get a good push in the pass rush.



That would be Rodrigue Wright.

However, Marcus Spears seems to be a really good fit with the schemes Wade Phillips uses.

GamblerLT5
01-03-2005, 07:55 PM
Yea our original 1st round pick is going to be very high and since this isnt the strongest of drafts I wouldnt be surprised if we actually traded up and got that impact player AJ could possibly be looking at. If we stay at 12 I like Pac-Man Jones or Ahmad Brooks

RMANCIL
01-03-2005, 07:57 PM
If you want to get after the passer you draft Dan Cody he is the best at rushing the passer on the board.

David Pollack, Georgia would be 1B on the pass rush front.

DL to play every down try either Anttaj Hawthorne, Wisconsin DE/DT Marcus Spears, L.S.U. DE/DT or Orien Harris, Miami (FL) DE/DT. The Bolts could take one from each group in the first round and they would really move the defense to a power plus that would improve the ST PLAY AS WELL.

I still think that the team had better draft a LOT but who knows they may be sold on Van Buren.

IronMountain1960
01-03-2005, 08:22 PM
Originally posted by: LT4mayor
We definitely need to go after a safety...jerry wilson is just a touch to slow...we all need to admit that our bigest mistake was getting rid of "Hot Rod" but oh well...if there is nobody worth taking in that position that high, then i say we go after a big play reciever, because who knows whats going to happen with Keenan. Also we saw how many rookie recievers stepped up this year
Jerry Wilson is supposedly the fastest guy on the team, but I agree with you he plays a second too slow, its football instincts that are important, if you can see what happening and get there before the ball then thats fast enough, having blazing speed and not reacting to the whats developing until its too late is bad reaction time, and you can be faster than anybody out on the field and still be late to the ball.
Rodney was a lousy pass defender, but would knock the snot out of any receiver in his area, and he was a definite plus for that reason.

I agree with those guys who say we need a #1 receiver and OLT most, and a pass rushing DE, although I think we have one in Dave Ball, another one to go in on passing downs for Igor, would be nice. I like Kiel, Milligan, Hart at safety, and Wilson must be doing something right to stay ahead of Milligan and Hart.

guimcharger
01-03-2005, 09:35 PM
Originally posted by: Chargeroo

Originally posted by: guimcharger
No more WR. McCardell, Parker, Caldwell, Osgood, and Floyd are all capable. Plus Osgood has some real potential if he could get in the starting line up.
How do you know Floyd is "capable"? We haven't seen him make even one catch yet. I'd have no problem with them taking a WR. Remember that WR's usually take a couple of years to start producing. Taking one this time could keep us going when McCardell retires.

Did you see Floyd playing in the game? I guess that answers your question wether he is capable. Just because a player wasn't drafted doesn't mean he isn't good. Look Parker, Osgood, and now Floyd. His height just gives him that advantage. 6-6 jumping over little 5-9 CB, I will take that match up all day.

IronMountain1960
01-03-2005, 10:16 PM
Krause made plays all game, Floyd was pushed off of the ball the first three passes thrown to him, and made poor efforts on all three balls. Floyd did make two good catches in the 2nd half, but Krause did it every time the ball was throw his way. I would give Krause an A and Floyd a B- for their games. Floyd could turn out to be great but right now I would put him behind Parker, McCardell, Osgood, Gates, Peele and Krause, and we still need a #1 receiver.

RMANCIL
01-03-2005, 10:27 PM
Dan Cody, Oklahoma DE/OLB will be center stage tomorrow night, he may be the best pass rushing DE/OLB in the draft. If you want to see a talent be sure to watch this game and key on him.

guimcharger
01-05-2005, 04:55 PM
Originally posted by: IronMountain
Krause made plays all game, Floyd was pushed off of the ball the first three passes thrown to him, and made poor efforts on all three balls. Floyd did make two good catches in the 2nd half, but Krause did it every time the ball was throw his way. I would give Krause an A and Floyd a B- for their games. Floyd could turn out to be great but right now I would put him behind Parker, McCardell, Osgood, Gates, Peele and Krause, and we still need a #1 receiver.

That was Floyds first game for crying out loud. Krause is pretty good and we don't need a number one receiver because we have a group of great receivers.

JoeMcRugby
01-05-2005, 05:08 PM
If Williams is on the board, grab Williams flat out. The Chargers do not have a potential #1 WR on the squad outside of the 34 year old McCardle.

Osgood, Parker and Caldwell are all #2 receivers tops. I wouldn't reach for a #1, but if #1 from USC is still on the board, grab him!! He'll make the aforementioned WRs all the more dangerous.

IgorUnchained
01-05-2005, 05:21 PM
Just a friendly reminder that we have Polk and Moreno on the IR, so we dont need LBs as much

Courtney Van Buren is on the IR, so we dont have as much need for O linemen

and when Keenan, TimmyD, and Reche are healthy they will join EP, Osgood, Gates, Krause, and the rest......giving us alot of depth in the receiving corps.

As far as a good pass rushing DE, look no further than the IR again...his name is Dave Ball and he was "Dan Cody" last year, just got banged up early.

Depth is Depth, and every team needs some- but we dont have any big glaring needs on the team...just a need to tweek the secondary a bit.

Capfan
01-05-2005, 07:32 PM
I'm going to go with the standard "guy they have rated the highest". Playing junior GM, I'd like the to add a Richard Seymour type DE at #12 and then a WR at #32 (wink wink) as long as there isn't a run on them like last year. If there is a run on Wr's, I'd like to see them add a OG. The #1 or 2 rated OG is usually still on the board at the end of the first.

I've changed my mind about drafting a WR. I like what they have for next year, but beyond that you have McCardell out of his contract and another year older and Caldwell's is up and while he's improved, he hasn't shown he can make it further than 8 games. I hope they grab a guy in the first 2 rounds.

I think DE is the biggest need at #12, but WR isn't a bad pick if they have a guy rated high and he falls to #12 based on what the 11 teams in front of them did. The best DE in the 3-4 may not be worthy of a #12 pick. They got a good one last year at the begining of round 2!

IronMountain1960
01-06-2005, 11:50 PM
Originally posted by: guimcharger

Originally posted by: IronMountain
Krause made plays all game, Floyd was pushed off of the ball the first three passes thrown to him, and made poor efforts on all three balls. Floyd did make two good catches in the 2nd half, but Krause did it every time the ball was throw his way. I would give Krause an A and Floyd a B- for their games. Floyd could turn out to be great but right now I would put him behind Parker, McCardell, Osgood, Gates, Peele and Krause, and we still need a #1 receiver.

That was Floyds first game for crying out loud. Krause is pretty good and we don't need a number one receiver because we have a group of great receivers.

Don't get me wrong, I like Floyd, but this was Kause's first game also, and he stood out big time. McCardell is getting old and we don't have a #1 reciever, so if Williams is on the board, I'll bet we go for him.

RMANCIL
01-08-2005, 03:32 AM
There are three first round wr on the board in Williams ,Edwards and Clayton.
The Chargers do not have a young go to wr. Caldwell after several disappointing seasons was playing much better however his injury was severe and he has been injured every season in the league.

Williams and Edwards have size

Williams 6'4"228 lbs 4.59 has size and strength DB will not be able to jam him and with his size and leaping ability he can out muscle almost any DB for the ball. He has great hands. He was considered a top 5 type of talent by many last season and would have certainly been drafted in the top 15. A year older ,stronger and perhaps a little faster. Being out of the spot light has to hurt on draft day, as air time in prime time helps come draft time. Speed or lack of big speed is his only down side.

Edwards 6'3" 208 lbs 4.45 has size and strength with deep speed good hands but not as good as Williams.
The big difference is the speed Edwards is more of a homerun threat he can stretch the field either by beating a db for the long ball or by breaking a tackle and out running the crowd that makes him very special. He has the frame to add some more size as well. He already is stronger than most DB and will not have a issue with the jam at the los.

Clayton 5'11" 187 lbs is more of a slot wr he can be jammed at the los and the slot or motion will be needed to get him off the los. He is more quick than fast he has great moves after the catch but does not have great hands,he struggles to make difficult catches in traffic. He is a great kick return ,punt return player and will stand out in those duties. He is the most elusive of the three after the catch by a wide margin.

I like Williams or Edwards and if one were on the board at the 12 slot he would be worthy of the selection imo, Clayton on the other hand I think is a better choice if he was on the board for our last first round slot, it is doubtful he would fall that low. His size does hold him back.

I do think the Bolts could go with several differant players and positions and until the Senior Bowl and the pro days/combine the field will stay a bit crowded.

Rip
01-08-2005, 03:52 AM
Originally posted by: IronMountain
Floyd could turn out to be great but right now I would put him behind Parker, McCardell, Osgood, Gates, Peele and Krause, and we still need a #1 receiver.

Hey Iron, i think you forgot to mention our best WR

Capfan
01-08-2005, 10:20 AM
Originally posted by: RMANCIL
There are three first round wr on the board in Williams ,Edwards and Clayton.
The Chargers do not have a young go to wr. Caldwell after several disappointing seasons was playing much better however his injury was severe and he has been injured every season in the league.

Williams and Edwards have size

Williams 6'4"228 lbs 4.59 has size and strength DB will not be able to jam him and with his size and leaping ability he can out muscle almost any DB for the ball. He has great hands. He was considered a top 5 type of talent by many last season and would have certainly been drafted in the top 15. A year older ,stronger and perhaps a little faster. Being out of the spot light has to hurt on draft day, as air time in prime time helps come draft time. Speed or lack of big speed is his only down side.

Edwards 6'3" 208 lbs 4.45 has size and strength with deep speed good hands but not as good as Williams.
The big difference is the speed Edwards is more of a homerun threat he can stretch the field either by beating a db for the long ball or by breaking a tackle and out running the crowd that makes him very special. He has the frame to add some more size as well. He already is stronger than most DB and will not have a issue with the jam at the los.

Clayton 5'11" 187 lbs is more of a slot wr he can be jammed at the los and the slot or motion will be needed to get him off the los. He is more quick than fast he has great moves after the catch but does not have great hands,he struggles to make difficult catches in traffic. He is a great kick return ,punt return player and will stand out in those duties. He is the most elusive of the three after the catch by a wide margin.

I like Williams or Edwards and if one were on the board at the 12 slot he would be worthy of the selection imo, Clayton on the other hand I think is a better choice if he was on the board for our last first round slot, it is doubtful he would fall that low. His size does hold him back.

I do think the Bolts could go with several differant players and positions and until the Senior Bowl and the pro days/combine the field will stay a bit crowded.

Good read. I really do think that either Williams or Edwards will be on the board at #12. I don't see any of the first 8 teams selecting a WR, but a trade up is always possible. The Redskins may en the Rod Gardner experiment and the Raiturds are the other wild card. Davis may be looking to add to the depth even if Porter stays.

I'd like to see them add the most dominating 3-4 DE in the draft, but if he can be had later, I'm not going to complain if they add one of the top 2 WR's in the draft.

ftwbolt
01-08-2005, 11:50 AM
http://www.nfldraftcountdown.c...s/underclassmen05.html (http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/features/underclassmen05.html)

2005 NFL DRAFT UNDERCLASSMAN

Player Position College Year



Jason Allen S Tennessee JR
Larry Brackins WR Pearl River Community College SO
Brandon Browner CB Oregon St. SO
Maurice Clarett RB Ohio St. JR
Channing Crowder ILB Florida SO
Thomas Davis S Georgia JR
Ciatrick Fason RB Florida JR
Frank Gore RB Miami (FL) JR
Jovan Haye DE Vanderbilt JR
Chris Henry WR West Virginia JR
Adam "Pac-Man" Jones CB West Virginia JR
T.A. McLendon RB North Carolina St. JR
Shawne Merriman DE Maryland JR
Justin Miller CB Clemson JR
Ryan Moats RB Louisiana Tech JR
Vernand Morency RB Oklahoma St. JR
Damien Nash RB Missouri JR
Roscoe Parrish WR Miami (FL) JR
Aaron Rodgers QB California JR
Peter Sands S Central Florida JR
Eric Shelton RB Louisville JR
Alex Smith QB Utah JR
Matthew Tant FB Vanderbilt JR
Odell Thurman ILB Georgia JR
Rian Wallace OLB Temple JR
Fabian Washington CB Nebraska JR
Mike Williams WR USC JR
Troy Williamson WR South Carolina JR

crazyman33
01-08-2005, 12:08 PM
nfldraftblitz has us taking marcus spears (DE, LSU) with our first pick and Rodney White (WR, UAB) with our 2nd first round pick..

Text (http://www.nfldraftblitz.com/mock_draft.htm)

ftwbolt
01-08-2005, 12:11 PM
Originally posted by: guimcharger

Originally posted by: IronMountain
Krause made plays all game, Floyd was pushed off of the ball the first three passes thrown to him, and made poor efforts on all three balls. Floyd did make two good catches in the 2nd half, but Krause did it every time the ball was throw his way. I would give Krause an A and Floyd a B- for their games. Floyd could turn out to be great but right now I would put him behind Parker, McCardell, Osgood, Gates, Peele and Krause, and we still need a #1 receiver.

That was Floyds first game for crying out loud. Krause is pretty good and we don't need a number one receiver because we have a group of great receivers.

You can't teach Speed, they either have or they don't. Route running, and pass catching etc , can be improved upon.
Nobody is saying that the Bolts don't have a good corp of receivers. But they do need one who can stretch a defense, aka-the home run ball.

Capfan
01-08-2005, 12:57 PM
Originally posted by: ftwbolt

Originally posted by: guimcharger

Originally posted by: IronMountain
Krause made plays all game, Floyd was pushed off of the ball the first three passes thrown to him, and made poor efforts on all three balls. Floyd did make two good catches in the 2nd half, but Krause did it every time the ball was throw his way. I would give Krause an A and Floyd a B- for their games. Floyd could turn out to be great but right now I would put him behind Parker, McCardell, Osgood, Gates, Peele and Krause, and we still need a #1 receiver.

That was Floyds first game for crying out loud. Krause is pretty good and we don't need a number one receiver because we have a group of great receivers.

You can't teach Speed, they either have or they don't. Route running, and pass catching etc , can be improved upon.
Nobody is saying that the Bolts don't have a good corp of receivers. But they do need one who can stretch a defense, aka-the home run ball.

And, if you look beyond next year, they have McCardell who's one season older and out of a contract and Caldwell, who's a F/A and a player who couldn't make it further than a handfull of games in each of his first 3 seasons. While it might not be the most pressing need, a WR should be added at some point in this draft.

banzai
01-09-2005, 08:38 AM
Everyone keeps talking about Antrell Rolle,but the DB that might be All Pro Calliber is Carlos Rodgers from Auburn,Talk about a hitter with an attitude...

stardrop
01-09-2005, 08:52 AM
I think the draft should be like any other top teams draft... Aren't we a top team now... you draft the best player on the board.. we should be better than drafting for a position. The elite teams draft players... the bottom teams draft to fill holes. With that said I think AJ Smith should be on the phone as soon as he can with guys who can make plays in the secondary. Free Agency!!!! I'd put Charles Woodson at the top of the list ( if healthy).... 1st round pick take the best player available..fingers crossed it's someone like Mike Williams... We have "nice" receivers but not "the" receiver....

MichaelzoneX
01-09-2005, 09:23 AM
Antrel rolle please

Boltjolt
01-09-2005, 11:05 AM
Originally posted by: stardrop
I think the draft should be like any other top teams draft... Aren't we a top team now... you draft the best player on the board.. we should be better than drafting for a position. The elite teams draft players... the bottom teams draft to fill holes. With that said I think AJ Smith should be on the phone as soon as he can with guys who can make plays in the secondary. Free Agency!!!! I'd put Charles Woodson at the top of the list ( if healthy).... 1st round pick take the best player available..fingers crossed it's someone like Mike Williams... We have "nice" receivers but not "the" receiver....


I wouldnt even have Woodson on my list. His best days are already behind him. Too expensive for a guy that is hurt a lot.

Capfan
01-09-2005, 11:14 AM
Originally posted by: Boltjolt

Originally posted by: stardrop
I think the draft should be like any other top teams draft... Aren't we a top team now... you draft the best player on the board.. we should be better than drafting for a position. The elite teams draft players... the bottom teams draft to fill holes. With that said I think AJ Smith should be on the phone as soon as he can with guys who can make plays in the secondary. Free Agency!!!! I'd put Charles Woodson at the top of the list ( if healthy).... 1st round pick take the best player available..fingers crossed it's someone like Mike Williams... We have "nice" receivers but not "the" receiver....


I wouldnt even have Woodson on my list. His best days are already behind him. Too expensive for a guy that is hurt a lot.

No kidding. I abolutely hate the idea chasing big money free agents. I don't care who it is. This is a very good team now that is about to add another draft class with 2 first rounders. Any salary cap space should be used to extend the contracts of players already on the roster who are close to testing free agency themselves and have earned a raise.

AJ did a fantastic job last year adding low budget free agents who are solid football players not superstars. And he was smart to restructure Tomlinson and Parker.

For god sakes. No more Wiley's, Boston's and Alexander's.

stardrop
01-09-2005, 11:28 AM
Ok.... then who do you add to the secondary.. It needs an overhaul...It's full of decent guys who don't make plays. Donnie Edwards had more picks this year than QJ in his career. The draft has almost no safeties and the free agent market is weak on safeties as well. Guy from Buffalo tops the list. So you trade for a safety or you upgrade at corner BIGTIME.. we can't afford to draft a starter in the secondary. The schedule next year is MURDER..... I threw out Woodson cuz he's better than all our DBs combined and he would get a shot twice a year at the Raiders.. who he hates now... Our front 7 on D got let down all year by our DBs.. that's where AJ needs to overhaul.. He needs a stud Wideout, a KO returner and DB help.....

sd123455
01-09-2005, 11:49 AM
id like to see us honestly trade the 12th pick (assuming edwards and williams are taken) and try to get someone to replace wilson at safety....hes bringin us down

Boltjolt
01-09-2005, 12:01 PM
Originally posted by: stardrop
Ok.... then who do you add to the secondary.. It needs an overhaul...It's full of decent guys who don't make plays. Donnie Edwards had more picks this year than QJ in his career. The draft has almost no safeties and the free agent market is weak on safeties as well. Guy from Buffalo tops the list. So you trade for a safety or you upgrade at corner BIGTIME.. we can't afford to draft a starter in the secondary. The schedule next year is MURDER..... I threw out Woodson cuz he's better than all our DBs combined and he would get a shot twice a year at the Raiders.. who he hates now... Our front 7 on D got let down all year by our DBs.. that's where AJ needs to overhaul.. He needs a stud Wideout, a KO returner and DB help.....

An overhaul??? Do you have a clue about this team?

Sammy Davis and Florence are second year players. Florence IMO is going to turn into a possible probowler if he keeps it up. He is a playmaker who will just keep getting better.

We need a safety, not a CB. Id hate to use a high pick on another CB and have more growing pains. Sorry, i dont think Antrel Rolle is going to step right in and solidify this secondary. Sean Taylor didnt play very at first. He needed to get adjusted.

This secondary is young and will improve. Woodson wont be an improvement while he is in the trainers room alll the time while paying him a ridiculous amount of money thqat he will demand.

\As far as the draft... obviously you arent big on the draft. There are some players......they dont neccessasrily have to come from the first round and there are a couple of FA's out there. There's possibilitys out there, they just arent obvious to most because everyone is focused on just the draft to get that player. There could be a trade for all we know.......we just dont know that yet.

Hec i thought Clinton Hart played very well in that game but they keep putting in Wilson. Hart made more plays than Wilson did all day and Hart played half the time.

Capfan
01-09-2005, 01:49 PM
Originally posted by: stardrop
Ok.... then who do you add to the secondary.. It needs an overhaul...It's full of decent guys who don't make plays. Donnie Edwards had more picks this year than QJ in his career. The draft has almost no safeties and the free agent market is weak on safeties as well. Guy from Buffalo tops the list. So you trade for a safety or you upgrade at corner BIGTIME.. we can't afford to draft a starter in the secondary. The schedule next year is MURDER..... I threw out Woodson cuz he's better than all our DBs combined and he would get a shot twice a year at the Raiders.. who he hates now... Our front 7 on D got let down all year by our DBs.. that's where AJ needs to overhaul.. He needs a stud Wideout, a KO returner and DB help.....


I don't think our secondary situation is as dire as you make it out. This is a team that went 12-4, won the West, and got sent home in an overtime game in the playoffs. Jammer is a quality corner. He takes on the opponents #1 WR and is going to get beat sometimes. It just happens. He did a fantastic job on Moss yesterday, and on the touchdown he got beat, he had excellent coverage and was a hair away from a deflection. It ws a beauty of a pass. Kiel was much improved this year as well.

I like Florence alot. He definitely progressed this year and is going to give Davis a run for his money next year. I also think Florence would make an excellent FS. He's got a nose for the ball and plays physical. They need to keep this guy on the field as much as possible.

rxe285
01-09-2005, 02:20 PM
draft Antrel Rolle CB Miami if he's still available or trade up to get him. Then move Jammer to FS he's played the position in college.

stardrop
01-09-2005, 03:15 PM
Maybe overhaul is too strong a word… My thought is we need help in the secondary. Not to win 12 games and win a mediocre conference.. see the loss to the Jets and what Indy did to Denver… but to compete in the postseason. To win in the playoffs and not be a surprise team. Sure if Kaeding makes the kick we live to play next week.

My point is the schedule is murder next year (Pittsburgh and Buffalo at home..Pats, Jets, Colts and Eagles on the Road) but the foundation is here now..TODAY.. So we can’t wait for guys to help in the draft or mature down the road. We need secondary help today. The Jets have the 22nd rated pass offense. It’s very vanilla and we couldn’t stop them. Sure Jammer can play and got burned deep and that happens but how did Moss and Jammer get 10 yards behind Jerry Wilson? How on their first touchdown was there no safety on the tight end. The Jets averaged 190 yards vs the NFL but managed 258 yards and 279 yards in the two games vs the Bolts.

So what to do. I think they need a leader back there to give the DBs a swagger. Someone who fits with the team. In the the draft..Nope.. Free agency..nope…So what? Two options.. Upgrade at corner and let our safeties grow around two solid corners? Or trade… I like trade which probably won’t happen so I suggested Woodson. He’s the best DB available. Talent wise. But we need a new face in the DB side of things. At least one….

Additions for next year..

Draft: We need to add overall depth but we need to add a bonefide stud pass rusher in the draft…as well as a deep threat on offense. We don’t got either.. We got a great bunch of possession receivers. Every game the DBs from other teams creep up.
So Mike Williams..or Braylon Edwards…. or Patterson, Johnson, Pollock etc….

On a trade…. How about this!!!!! Rivers to Dallas for Roy Williams…….

HeadTrip
01-09-2005, 03:31 PM
We cant trade PR because the cap hit would be too much to handle. Maybe Drew for Williams and a few picks (including a first). I dont want to trade Drew but Dallas is hurting at QB and we could get a whole lot of quality collateral for him.

Boltjolt
01-09-2005, 04:13 PM
Originally posted by: stardrop
Maybe overhaul is too strong a word… My thought is we need help in the secondary. Not to win 12 games and win a mediocre conference.. see the loss to the Jets and what Indy did to Denver… but to compete in the postseason. To win in the playoffs and not be a surprise team. Sure if Kaeding makes the kick we live to play next week.

My point is the schedule is murder next year (Pittsburgh and Buffalo at home..Pats, Jets, Colts and Eagles on the Road) but the foundation is here now..TODAY.. So we can’t wait for guys to help in the draft or mature down the road. We need secondary help today. The Jets have the 22nd rated pass offense. It’s very vanilla and we couldn’t stop them. Sure Jammer can play and got burned deep and that happens but how did Moss and Jammer get 10 yards behind Jerry Wilson? How on their first touchdown was there no safety on the tight end. The Jets averaged 190 yards vs the NFL but managed 258 yards and 279 yards in the two games vs the Bolts.

So what to do. I think they need a leader back there to give the DBs a swagger. Someone who fits with the team. In the the draft..Nope.. Free agency..nope…So what? Two options.. Upgrade at corner and let our safeties grow around two solid corners? Or trade… I like trade which probably won’t happen so I suggested Woodson. He’s the best DB available. Talent wise. But we need a new face in the DB side of things. At least one….

Additions for next year..

Draft: We need to add overall depth but we need to add a bonefide stud pass rusher in the draft…as well as a deep threat on offense. We don’t got either.. We got a great bunch of possession receivers. Every game the DBs from other teams creep up.
So Mike Williams..or Braylon Edwards…. or Patterson, Johnson, Pollock etc….

On a trade…. How about this!!!!! Rivers to Dallas for Roy Williams…….

You have a small point on some. But for the most part, i do not agree.

First you tell me we need to get a CB, then you come back with Rivers for Roy Williams i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif

Dallas wouldnt make that deal and i wouldnt blame them.

Woodson is just a NO as far as i concerned. He was franchised last year and got top dollar. He will want top dollar again and he is hurt all the time. He isnt worth it. Then if you do get him, you want to trade Rivers.

So tell me. How will you sign Woodson for big bucks, trade Rivers and eat his millions and then resign Brees for his millions? Then you have 4 million for rookie pool for which we have two fisrt round picks. Then you have to take care of Gates.

No thanks to Woodson who hasnt done anything in three years now.

Jerry Wilson sucks, i dont deny that..in fact, i second that. But your saying we need a corner.
As i said, there are other options but i just dont see tht drafting another CB in the first round is the answer. We can get a safety. I think just letting Wilson go and letting Hart play will make it more solid but im sure they will do more than that.

Boltjolt
01-09-2005, 05:01 PM
Originally posted by: Boltjolt

Originally posted by: stardrop
Maybe overhaul is too strong a word… My thought is we need help in the secondary. Not to win 12 games and win a mediocre conference.. see the loss to the Jets and what Indy did to Denver… but to compete in the postseason. To win in the playoffs and not be a surprise team. Sure if Kaeding makes the kick we live to play next week.

My point is the schedule is murder next year (Pittsburgh and Buffalo at home..Pats, Jets, Colts and Eagles on the Road) but the foundation is here now..TODAY.. So we can’t wait for guys to help in the draft or mature down the road. We need secondary help today. The Jets have the 22nd rated pass offense. It’s very vanilla and we couldn’t stop them. Sure Jammer can play and got burned deep and that happens but how did Moss and Jammer get 10 yards behind Jerry Wilson? How on their first touchdown was there no safety on the tight end. The Jets averaged 190 yards vs the NFL but managed 258 yards and 279 yards in the two games vs the Bolts.

So what to do. I think they need a leader back there to give the DBs a swagger. Someone who fits with the team. In the the draft..Nope.. Free agency..nope…So what? Two options.. Upgrade at corner and let our safeties grow around two solid corners? Or trade… I like trade which probably won’t happen so I suggested Woodson. He’s the best DB available. Talent wise. But we need a new face in the DB side of things. At least one….

Additions for next year..

Draft: We need to add overall depth but we need to add a bonefide stud pass rusher in the draft…as well as a deep threat on offense. We don’t got either.. We got a great bunch of possession receivers. Every game the DBs from other teams creep up.
So Mike Williams..or Braylon Edwards…. or Patterson, Johnson, Pollock etc….

On a trade…. How about this!!!!! Rivers to Dallas for Roy Williams…….

You have a small point on some. But for the most part, i do not agree.

First you tell me we need to get a CB, then you come back with Rivers for Roy Williams

Dallas wouldnt make that deal and i wouldnt blame them.

Woodson is just a NO as far as i concerned. He was franchised last year and got top dollar. He will want top dollar again and he is hurt all the time. He isnt worth it. Then if you do get him, you want to trade Rivers.

So tell me. How will you sign Woodson for big bucks, trade Rivers and eat his millions and then resign Brees for his millions? Then you have 4 million for rookie pool for which we have two fisrt round picks. Then you have to take care of Gates.

No thanks to Woodson who hasnt done anything in three years now.

Jerry Wilson sucks, i dont deny that..in fact, i second that. But your saying we need a corner.
As i said, there are other options but i just dont see that drafting another CB in the first round is the answer. I also dont think it is out of the question either, but i hope they dont do that. There are several good CB's n this draft and i dont think Rolle is the undisputed best . Id be just as happy with Carlos Rogers...but again...i hope they dont go this route. Growing pains stink.
We can get a safety. I think just letting Wilson go and letting Hart play will make it more solid but im sure they will do more than that.

stardrop
01-09-2005, 05:15 PM
I guess I just feel we are close..so you make a run.. second we go to Rivers they will dump salary and rebuild. So why not spend but spend wisely next year. We need a stud on both sides of the ball. My trade for Williams was a dream cuz we really need safety help. The reality is though if you can't get a safety upgrade you have to upgrade at CB. HAVE TO. Also remember there will be some subtractions and we already have 21Mil in cap space.. Im sure if you chose to lock brees up and dump rivers you could get drew to backend some money and maybe offset some money in a trade for rivers. Not to mention guys like Justin Peele etc. won't be back. You can't go back in time but imagine the same trade in 04 but taking Roy Williams( Detroit). Yum!!!!!!! Should be interesting. They dump Brees and will be back to 6-10. They keep him then what do they do with Rivers. Too expensive to ride the bench. Whatever moves they make they need to be impact moves for 2005.....

Hutch187
01-09-2005, 06:02 PM
Sign Porter from the Raiders, hurts them helps us on two fronts, we will not have to cover him, and he is a big strong and fast wr to go along with McCardell, Parker, and Ozgood, it is time to drop Dwight, then we can use our two first rounds one a pure pass rusher, and a safety or true shut down corner, lets face it Jammer is a good nb 2 but not a shut down type, move Florance to the the other safter spot with Kiel and run with it. What our you thoughts

crazyman33
01-09-2005, 06:42 PM
u no what would a good 2nd first round pick or 2nd round pick if he comes out(tho i doubt he will) Justin Tuck. hes like 6'5 260... i see him being the next terell suggs. put him at OLB and watch him and foley rack up sacks and get constant pressure on the qb

rfw14sun
01-09-2005, 08:27 PM
I think bottom line we need a wr and a pass rusher. But first a reciever. Sure, we have Parker and ossgood, but there is not guarrente that Mcardell will be back next year, and even if he is, he is still pretty old, so i think a receiver first, and then a pass rusher.