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GamblerLT5
01-09-2005, 07:35 PM
Our 2005 secondary hopefully will look as follows...

I say we draft Pac-Man Jones with our first pick in the 1st round and have him start at 1 CB.
Then Move Jammer to FS where he played some in college...then we could maybe even draft another DB in the 2nd like Jimmy Williams or Darnell Bing and have them play alongside Jammer at safeties. We would have a very talented secondary and it would be locked up for years to come with all of them being so young.

CB - Jones (Draft:1st)
CB - Florence
Nickel Back - Davis
FS - Jammer
SS - Kiel for now (Possibly Draft Bing/Williams:2nd rd.)

Our secondary was exposed last night when we gave up that much yardage and 2 TD's to a regularly weak passing offense.

phicart
01-10-2005, 12:23 AM
Most reports I've seen have Jones at 5 and Marlin Jackson at one or two (behind Antrel Rolle of Miami). Can probably get Jackson with our second pick. Besides, Jackson is bigger, stronger and faster from the stats I've seen.

Rip
01-10-2005, 05:21 AM
Or how about we get Thomas Davis and not worry about our Safties for the next 5 years.

Kiel and Thomas would make the rest of this secondary looks decent, as long as jammer learns to make a play on the BALL

MaddenChamp
01-10-2005, 03:51 PM
i think its the way our secondary is being coached.

mgpretzel
01-10-2005, 04:07 PM
I think that because Jammer and Florance are very physical guys they should be on the line bummping the guys right away. but they always seem to be 3 to five yards off. This is not their fault this is the way the choaches want them to. I say let 'em bummp the WRs. That way the WRs dont get a free release and beat 'em.


Sammy ALWAYS plays 10 yards off.lol.

Capfan
01-10-2005, 07:38 PM
I believe Florence could be an All-pro FS. He's got a nose for the ball and plays a physical game. Plus it allows for more smoke and mirrors in the 3-4. The blitzes can come from anywhere when you have a safety that can cover a WR 1 on 1.

There's nothing wrong with Jammer where he is. He's a shut down corner as is. People get on him but seem to forget he draws the opponents top WR each week. The guy is going to have some balls caught on him. It happens to the best of them.

Kiel was much improved this year and I love Hart and Milligan for depth. If they were to draft a CB with their high #1 I'd have no problem. I want both picks to got to the D. Let the Rookie battle Davis for the nickel.

BallerStyz
01-11-2005, 12:11 AM
If carlos joseph falls to the bolts second first rounder, it would be a solid pick up. Jackson and Rolle maybe faster than joseph, but joseph knows how to get in position and he is very good at open field tackling.

GamblerLT5
01-11-2005, 04:41 PM
You mean Carlos Rogers CB out of Auburn?

arod9876
01-11-2005, 05:11 PM
we should get Antrell Rolle and move jammer to FS since he played that in college.

FSJammer SSKiel
CBFlorence CBRolle


That way we can have two dominating corners in Florence and Rolle, and move Davis to nickel

TRUiceman
01-11-2005, 05:56 PM
i dont know what planet you lived on but jammer didnt play saftey in college....he played the shut down corner for the longhorns....of all the great teams texas plays every year and the great recievers he has faced in college...he only let one touchdown score on him in his career as a longhorn....and how did he do this.....being physical and not letting recivers off the line without being smacked around....he does this for us next year and we've got ourselves a great corner....but we just need the DB coach to figure that out....someone people can play off the line and zone like coverages....and some people play man-to-man bump and run....we have ourselves a bump and run corner....lets let him play it

jjdizub
01-12-2005, 08:52 PM
TRUiceman...
Jammer played his first two seasons at safety and was starting a third at the position when he dislocated his shoulder and was granted a medical redshirt... Then in his fourth year, he moved to corner where he played for his last two years...
I think the idea of moving him to safety would be to allow him to continue the physical play that he excelled at in college since corners aren't really even allowed to play their position anymore (that is an exaggeration but I think the contact rule makes the corner position very difficult)...

Dago81
01-12-2005, 10:47 PM
we don't need any more CB's...We either need a good pass rushing LB or a Huge DE.... maybe during the offseason pick up a VET DB

phicart
01-12-2005, 10:54 PM
Originally posted by: Rip
Or how about we get Thomas Davis and not worry about our Safties for the next 5 years.

Kiel and Thomas would make the rest of this secondary looks decent, as long as jammer learns to make a play on the BALL

Too expensive...he's probably the top rated safety in the draft and and will be gone in the first 20 picks. Can get Shazor with a second round pick and the talent difference is minor. Besides, Shazor, with mid 4 40 speed could bulk up to a pass rushing line backer in a year or two. He's just a kid at 6'3" and 225 now. Jammer's problem is mental...he knows he was drafted as the second coming, but found out that the pros are different than college. He just can't do it all by himself. He needs a buddy on the other side of equal skill. That's why I want Jackson back there too. Our secondary got physically beat to death this year...not skill wise, but injury wise. Need skill...need depth.

IgorUnchained
01-12-2005, 11:13 PM
Originally posted by: Rip
Or how about we get Thomas Davis and not worry about our Safties for the next 5 years.

Kiel and Thomas would make the rest of this secondary looks decent, as long as jammer learns to make a play on the BALL



Ive been on the Thomas Davis bandwagon since I saw a post of yours a while ago. I thought he might be around early enough for us to get him with our 2nd first rounder. Last night I checked a mock draft and Davis was picked to go 10th overall.

It is my opinion that we could do alot worse with our first pick, but doubt that the Chargers would use their first pick on a safety. Theres alot of time between now and draft day, I hope that something happens where we are able to get this guy....he would make our secondary something to be feared and he would be a useful tool against the running game as well.

I say secondary should be the first concern on draft day-- it has been our weak point and it would help the special teams as well. Go Bolts and Go AJ!

phicart
01-14-2005, 02:48 AM
Originally posted by: IgorUnchained

Originally posted by: Rip
Or how about we get Thomas Davis and not worry about our Safties for the next 5 years.

Kiel and Thomas would make the rest of this secondary looks decent, as long as jammer learns to make a play on the BALL



Ive been on the Thomas Davis bandwagon since I saw a post of yours a while ago. I thought he might be around early enough for us to get him with our 2nd first rounder. Last night I checked a mock draft and Davis was picked to go 10th overall.

It is my opinion that we could do alot worse with our first pick, but doubt that the Chargers would use their first pick on a safety. Theres alot of time between now and draft day, I hope that something happens where we are able to get this guy....he would make our secondary something to be feared and he would be a useful tool against the running game as well.

I say secondary should be the first concern on draft day-- it has been our weak point and it would help the special teams as well. Go Bolts and Go AJ!


You're right about our needs...no question there. You're also right with the "go AJ". When you look at what we need, what draft picks we have, and what talent is available, We're in pretty darn good shape. Remember, we went 12-5 this year...that's 17 games sted 16. I doubt there is a whisker's worth of difference between the top two Free and strong safeties in this years draft. Our starting safeties are barely 200 pounds and can only hit 6 foot with elevator shoes! Still, we finished 12-5. The top four prospects are all over 6 foot and pushing 220...my guy Shazor has mid 4 speed with the rest of the gang within hundreths. The stats on all of them are amazingly similar...lead team in tackles...has coverage issues. Why sweat Davis? Let Detroit have him. Will get a safety of equal or better value for less money.
WR is different. If you are looking at the same mock draft I am, only three teams are projected to grab aWR in the first...Chicago, us and Baltimore in that order. The experts say Chicago will take Williams (maybe they're a bit shy about taking another Michigan receiver in the first round with Terrell still on the payroll!). Cool, 'cause you all have heard me preach about why I like Edwards for us over Williams (new guys think 4.45 to 4.65). Now, I could be wrong about this, and I won't mind somebody smarter telling me so, but isn't our current fastest WR older than dirt (although, after seeing Kassim chase down Dante, I'd like to see a race between he and Tim).

tytomkiel
01-16-2005, 09:03 PM
Did Bing even declare for the draft? I like Bing a lot he would be a great fit, but if not I think that we should use a first round pick on Thomas Davis of Georgia, he's fast big and a punishing hitter.

arod9876
01-17-2005, 12:45 PM
Originally posted by: TRUiceman
i dont know what planet you lived on but jammer didnt play saftey in college....he played the shut down corner for the longhorns....of all the great teams texas plays every year and the great recievers he has faced in college...he only let one touchdown score on him in his career as a longhorn....and how did he do this.....being physical and not letting recivers off the line without being smacked around....he does this for us next year and we've got ourselves a great corner....but we just need the DB coach to figure that out....someone people can play off the line and zone like coverages....and some people play man-to-man bump and run....we have ourselves a bump and run corner....lets let him play it

i dont know what planet you live on but jammer did play safety on college and he dominated

guimcharger
01-17-2005, 02:31 PM
CB=Jammer
CB=D Flo
SS=Kiel
FS=Miligan, Hart, or a new person.

I don't know why everyone is mad at Jammer he is a great CB. He just looked bad at times because he had no FS help from Wilson. D Flo came into his own and will be better next year. Kiel is a stud. Miligan and Hart both have some great potential.

phicart
01-20-2005, 04:47 PM
Originally posted by: guimcharger
CB=Jammer
CB=D Flo
SS=Kiel
FS=Miligan, Hart, or a new person.

I don't know why everyone is mad at Jammer he is a great CB. He just looked bad at times because he had no FS help from Wilson. D Flo came into his own and will be better next year. Kiel is a stud. Miligan and Hart both have some great potential.

I understand the love of Davis and I don't think folks are mad at Jammer. Think it's more about Jammer needing some versitile help. I do agree that what we have is good. I just don't think they have the potential to be as flexible as what we need. Forgot who it was for the Patriots, but whoever it was summed up the point precisely..."We have a great defensive coaching staff and the ATHLETES to perform whatever task they assign us." Davis is appealing because he has the athleticism to be that kind of player. Unfortunately, he will be gone by the time we draft. Are we desperate enough to trade away draft choices to fill that position? Doesn't seem worth it to me. There are others we can get later who are darn near as good and a heck of a lot cheaper. I haven't seen or heard anything yet to move me off the position of WR first, speed cover versitile CB second and big, strong, versitile and fast FS or SS third. These choices are within the range of doable with what we have.

smlman2
01-22-2005, 04:13 PM
no we dont need to draft more rookies on this team. a Fs in free agnecy is all we need and let jammer florence and davis fight for the top corner spots. jammer ussually got beat when he was suppose to have safety help and it wasnt there which made him look bad. he also was just one the wrong end of some great plays this season... like santanna moss's catch.

Infernus
01-22-2005, 06:32 PM
I seen a lot of drafts that have detroit drafting Davis.

phicart
01-23-2005, 06:13 PM
Originally posted by: smlman2
no we dont need to draft more rookies on this team. a Fs in free agnecy is all we need and let jammer florence and davis fight for the top corner spots. jammer ussually got beat when he was suppose to have safety help and it wasnt there which made him look bad. he also was just one the wrong end of some great plays this season... like santanna moss's catch.

I understand where you are coming from, but think we should remember what we did this year with the team we have. If we don't draft rookies (which you have to do by definition), our only option is to trade our draft picks for veterans. You do that, you run the risk of getting a Boston or Wiley...you don't, you run the risk of getting a Leaf. Also, which free agent safety is worth taking a look at? This is probably the worst year to go after that position in free agency. I've just seen a mock draft that has us taking Shazor at 28. The guy is 6'4", 230 and ran a 4.45 40 and bench pressed 300 pounds in high school. Considering all, I'd take the chance.

guimcharger
01-23-2005, 06:38 PM
Originally posted by: phicart

Originally posted by: guimcharger
CB=Jammer
CB=D Flo
SS=Kiel
FS=Miligan, Hart, or a new person.

I don't know why everyone is mad at Jammer he is a great CB. He just looked bad at times because he had no FS help from Wilson. D Flo came into his own and will be better next year. Kiel is a stud. Miligan and Hart both have some great potential.

I understand the love of Davis and I don't think folks are mad at Jammer. Think it's more about Jammer needing some versitile help. I do agree that what we have is good. I just don't think they have the potential to be as flexible as what we need. Forgot who it was for the Patriots, but whoever it was summed up the point precisely..."We have a great defensive coaching staff and the ATHLETES to perform whatever task they assign us." Davis is appealing because he has the athleticism to be that kind of player. Unfortunately, he will be gone by the time we draft. Are we desperate enough to trade away draft choices to fill that position? Doesn't seem worth it to me. There are others we can get later who are darn near as good and a heck of a lot cheaper. I haven't seen or heard anything yet to move me off the position of WR first, speed cover versitile CB second and big, strong, versitile and fast FS or SS third. These choices are within the range of doable with what we have.

What you wrote had nothing to do with my quote.

mojorasol
01-23-2005, 06:49 PM
i think an addition to the secondary will be necessary this year. id like to add a cb and move either jammer or florence to safety to team with kiel, a veteran corner would be nice.

but first i think we need to improve the pass rush, a biiiiig DE and or a fast OLB should do the trick. these i think can best be filled through the draft this year. the DE spears from LSU and the OLB johnson from TEX would be incredible and with a veteran corner added to our young talented secondary the defense would be greatly improved and deep.

who are the free agent corners available? i know fred smoot is out there but he will eat up a lot of cap room...

ryear04
01-23-2005, 06:59 PM
Originally posted by: arod9876
we should get Antrell Rolle and move jammer to FS since he played that in college.

FSJammer SSKiel
CBFlorence CBRolle


[/H]


I agree with you up untill you say switch Jammer to FS... keep Jammer at CB and move Florence to FS!! Jammer is alot better the florence... Have you noticed his name wasn't called that much this year... thats because he shuts down his WR's and the QB cant throwthe ball to him... Yeah he messes up sometimes but who dosen't??

mojorasol
01-23-2005, 07:13 PM
hey the two cb free agents to watch are fred smoot and gary baxter from baltamore (at least thats what the website i found said.)

i think they need to land one of these two and move florence or jammer to s.

the rest of the free agent crop is pretty thin, the most appealing one to me is wr jerry porter from oakland. he would compliment gates and mccardell as a deep threat... wow.

imagine if we landed baxter, drafted spears, and johnson and brought in porter...

wow...

now whos gonna play qb?

phicart
01-23-2005, 09:10 PM
Why a CB instead of a Safety? You draft, trade for or pick up a free agent CB and move one of our existing CB's to safety, you end up with two guys in a new position. If we need a safety, draft, trade for or pick up a free agent. As I said earlier, though, the free agent safety market is bunk. Draft Shazor and play him. He'll get burned early, but we should still win enough games to make the playoffs. He'll be ready by then.

guimcharger
01-23-2005, 10:29 PM
Originally posted by: mojorasol
i think an addition to the secondary will be necessary this year. id like to add a cb and move either jammer or florence to safety to team with kiel, a veteran corner would be nice.

but first i think we need to improve the pass rush, a biiiiig DE and or a fast OLB should do the trick. these i think can best be filled through the draft this year. the DE spears from LSU and the OLB johnson from TEX would be incredible and with a veteran corner added to our young talented secondary the defense would be greatly improved and deep.

who are the free agent corners available? i know fred smoot is out there but he will eat up a lot of cap room...

Jammer is not going to play FS ever in his career. Why does everyone say that? Jammer is a good corner. For you people that didn't notice when Jammer appeared to get burned it was because he was playing zone and let the reciever go to wilson (After the receiver was out of his zone) who was too slow to cover the WR.

mojorasol
01-23-2005, 11:55 PM
personally i like the idea of having safeties that can cover like corners...

we will need a new seond round pick to take shazor, he will go early in the second round, hell be gone by 61. he sounds good though.

so its settled then, we take OLB johnson, DE spears and SS shazor with our first three selections...

phicart
01-24-2005, 02:28 PM
Me too...that is liking the idea of a safety that can tackle, pass rush, AND has the speed to cover deep. One of the mock drafts I've seen has us taking Shaun Cody with the first pick, Shazor at 28 and Chris Henry, WR West Virginia, at 61. I agree with you, however, at number 12...we need someone at that pick with more speed and versitility. What happens if we want to fool someone and drop the DE back into coverage on the tight end while blitzing a linebacker? Cody can't do that. Besides, I'm betting he ends up a defensive tackle. Chris Henry is interesting at 61...he's got speed, and height - 6'4", but a little thin at 200. Of course he is still a growing kid.

Balboa 1961
01-24-2005, 06:06 PM
I think the reason people are down on Jammer is that he cost us a top 5 pick. You expect a guy drafted that high to be pro bolw caliber. Don't think he is near there yet.

JoeMcRugby
01-24-2005, 06:30 PM
Originally posted by: phicart
Me too...that is liking the idea of a safety that can tackle, pass rush, AND has the speed to cover deep. One of the mock drafts I've seen has us taking Shaun Cody with the first pick, Shazor at 28 and Chris Henry, WR West Virginia, at 61. I agree with you, however, at number 12...we need someone at that pick with more speed and versitility. What happens if we want to fool someone and drop the DE back into coverage on the tight end while blitzing a linebacker? Cody can't do that. Besides, I'm betting he ends up a defensive tackle. Chris Henry is interesting at 61...he's got speed, and height - 6'4", but a little thin at 200. Of course he is still a growing kid.

From the Senior Bowl string:
__________________________________________________ __________________

The first prospect that the Bolts targeted should bring a smile to many a face. Storming around the concourse, they met up with USC defensive tackle Shaun Cody and wrangled him into a private corner. Fifteen minutes later, they let go of the lasso.

Cody, fresh off his meeting with the Chargers, said he would love to stay in Southern California while also saying he would be happy to play anywhere.

A couple of teams have targeted Cody as an ideal fit in the 3-4 defense and most of them have been inquisitive about his weight.

At 6-foot-4, 295 pounds, Cody said “the most I have ever weighed was 300 pounds.”

Cody has a nice burst off the snap, coupled with a good swim move. He has a lot of energy and brings that consistently to the table. His weight and ability to put on some extra pounds could define what team takes him. Right now it appears the left defensive end in the 3-4 is perfect for him.

His outward appearance is well defined for his weight. He does not appear to have much fat and fits his body well at his current weight.

chrisx448
01-24-2005, 06:57 PM
FS: Jammer
SS: Kiel
CB: Brandon Browner (second first round pick)
CB: Drayton Florence



Jammer with his speed and athleticism would be a tight FS. He can hit and he would have great range, he would just have to put on like 15lbs.

Brandon Browner would be an awesome pick for the chargers, with his size (6'4) he would be a great match-up with Randy Moss if the trade goes through with the raiders. Many consider him to be the most talented of all the CB's in this years draft and he is young and a little inexperienced but he has loads of potential and he could be a very special player.

chrisx448
01-24-2005, 06:58 PM
Originally posted by: MaddenChamp
i think its the way our secondary is being coached.



THATS WHAT IVE BEEN SAYING!!

phicart
01-24-2005, 09:18 PM
Originally posted by: chrisx448
FS: Jammer
SS: Kiel
CB: Brandon Browner (second first round pick)
CB: Drayton Florence



Jammer with his speed and athleticism would be a tight FS. He can hit and he would have great range, he would just have to put on like 15lbs.

Brandon Browner would be an awesome pick for the chargers, with his size (6'4) he would be a great match-up with Randy Moss if the trade goes through with the raiders. Many consider him to be the most talented of all the CB's in this years draft and he is young and a little inexperienced but he has loads of potential and he could be a very special player.

Guimcharger is right...Jammer will not be moved to safety. I also agree that the problem was not so much with our starting corners as with our CB depth and safeties. Browner is projected to go as high as 8 to Arizona...Dallas and Detroit also are looking at corners. Nobody in front of our 12 is said to be looking at a safety. The only team in front of our 28 looking for a safety is Cincinnati and they are looking more towards a free safety...Thomas Davis. Shazor is the top rated strong safety in the draft and we can get him at 21. Final time...keep Jammer where he was born to play, Shazor is bigger 6'4" and 230 to 6'0" and 204 and he is faster - 4.45 to 4.55. When Jammer knows he finally has someone watching his back, he'll be worth what we're paying him.

phicart
01-24-2005, 09:35 PM
Originally posted by: JoeMcRugby

The first prospect that the Bolts targeted should bring a smile to many a face. Storming around the concourse, they met up with USC defensive tackle Shaun Cody and wrangled him into a private corner. Fifteen minutes later, they let go of the lasso.

Cody, fresh off his meeting with the Chargers, said he would love to stay in Southern California while also saying he would be happy to play anywhere.

A couple of teams have targeted Cody as an ideal fit in the 3-4 defense and most of them have been inquisitive about his weight.

At 6-foot-4, 295 pounds, Cody said “the most I have ever weighed was 300 pounds.”

Cody has a nice burst off the snap, coupled with a good swim move. He has a lot of energy and brings that consistently to the table. His weight and ability to put on some extra pounds could define what team takes him. Right now it appears the left defensive end in the 3-4 is perfect for him.

His outward appearance is well defined for his weight. He does not appear to have much fat and fits his body well at his current weight.


OK, I'm still not totally convinced, but acknowledge your conviction. I will admit that like the fact that Cody played on a minor league pro team...errr...USC. He must have learned something chasing Leinart around in practice. Tell you what, if we get him and he turns out to be a stud, I'll buy you a beer(gotta be 21 or over though)...if he's a bust, your buying(if you're under 21, a 6 pack of Pepsi will do)!

chrisx448
01-25-2005, 06:05 PM
Originally posted by: phicart

Originally posted by: chrisx448
FS: Jammer
SS: Kiel
CB: Brandon Browner (second first round pick)
CB: Drayton Florence



Jammer with his speed and athleticism would be a tight FS. He can hit and he would have great range, he would just have to put on like 15lbs.

Brandon Browner would be an awesome pick for the chargers, with his size (6'4) he would be a great match-up with Randy Moss if the trade goes through with the raiders. Many consider him to be the most talented of all the CB's in this years draft and he is young and a little inexperienced but he has loads of potential and he could be a very special player.

Guimcharger is right...Jammer will not be moved to safety. I also agree that the problem was not so much with our starting corners as with our CB depth and safeties. Browner is projected to go as high as 8 to Arizona...Dallas and Detroit also are looking at corners. Nobody in front of our 12 is said to be looking at a safety. The only team in front of our 28 looking for a safety is Cincinnati and they are looking more towards a free safety...Thomas Davis. Shazor is the top rated strong safety in the draft and we can get him at 21. Final time...keep Jammer where he was born to play, Shazor is bigger 6'4" and 230 to 6'0" and 204 and he is faster - 4.45 to 4.55. When Jammer knows he finally has someone watching his back, he'll be worth what we're paying him.

chrisx448
01-25-2005, 06:07 PM
sorry that was an accident, what i meant to say was... its no good having 2 hard hitting safeties. with kiel and shazor our secondary would get beat even worse than this and last year... we need a cover FS if anything which there isnt any in the draft. we should trade for one since they only even good S in Free Agency is Dwight Smith if we cant get him.

bluegold81
01-25-2005, 06:45 PM
A veteran presence in the secondary is a must Donovan Darious is a free agent but could be tagged with franchise player again this year he would be a great pick-up

arod9876
01-25-2005, 07:01 PM
I agree with you up untill you say switch Jammer to FS... keep Jammer at CB and move Florence to FS!! Jammer is alot better the florence... Have you noticed his name wasn't called that much this year... thats because he shuts down his WR's and the QB cant throwthe ball to him... Yeah he messes up sometimes but who dosen't??


that would be an even better idea but it would take florence a year or two to learn FS and we need one now

JoeMcRugby
01-25-2005, 07:08 PM
Originally posted by: phicart

Originally posted by: JoeMcRugby

The first prospect that the Bolts targeted should bring a smile to many a face. Storming around the concourse, they met up with USC defensive tackle Shaun Cody and wrangled him into a private corner. Fifteen minutes later, they let go of the lasso.

Cody, fresh off his meeting with the Chargers, said he would love to stay in Southern California while also saying he would be happy to play anywhere.

A couple of teams have targeted Cody as an ideal fit in the 3-4 defense and most of them have been inquisitive about his weight.

At 6-foot-4, 295 pounds, Cody said “the most I have ever weighed was 300 pounds.”

Cody has a nice burst off the snap, coupled with a good swim move. He has a lot of energy and brings that consistently to the table. His weight and ability to put on some extra pounds could define what team takes him. Right now it appears the left defensive end in the 3-4 is perfect for him.

His outward appearance is well defined for his weight. He does not appear to have much fat and fits his body well at his current weight.

OK, I'm still not totally convinced, but acknowledge your conviction. I will admit that like the fact that Cody played on a minor league pro team...errr...USC. He must have learned something chasing Leinart around in practice. Tell you what, if we get him and he turns out to be a stud, I'll buy you a beer(gotta be 21 or over though)...if he's a bust, your buying(if you're under 21, a 6 pack of Pepsi will do)!

I'd like to take credit for that evaluation, but I can't. It was from the Chargers Insider website. I put the link in the "Senior Bowl" string, but to make it perfectly clear that I'm not plagarizing, here's the link:

http://chargers.scout.com/2/345485.html

Unfortunately, it's a pay website.

phicart
01-26-2005, 08:55 PM
Originally posted by: chrisx448
sorry that was an accident, what i meant to say was... its no good having 2 hard hitting safeties. with kiel and shazor our secondary would get beat even worse than this and last year... we need a cover FS if anything which there isnt any in the draft. we should trade for one since they only even good S in Free Agency is Dwight Smith if we cant get him.

Didn't know he was a free agent...regardless, Smith and Kiel would be an interesting safety duo if nothing else...one gut shot, the other a gun carrier. I disagree about two hard hitting safeties...I'd like to see a defensive backfield where they all strike fear in the hearts of anyone entering their territory. I also think Wilson was the issue...he was the free safety, been around the league for 10 years and had deep responsibility. Kiel got stuck into the strong safety job after Lassiter went down in '03 and had some issues. This year we had 5'10 190 Wilson and 5'11 207 Keil as the best safeties on the roster...who you gonna put at strong? I think we already have a decent cover FS - Kiel - that's where he started and that's where he should be...he's had 4 picks in four years compared to Wilson's 9 picks in 7 years. Strong safety is a tackler first and a cover guy second...Shazor lead Michigan with tackles last year. As a cover guy, I've already said he will get burned ealry...not as a matter of ability, but as a matter of a lack of experience...the guy's too aggressive and bites on fakes. That'll be for the coaches to fix.

SDynasty
01-26-2005, 10:04 PM
Originally posted by: ryear04

Originally posted by: arod9876
we should get Antrell Rolle and move jammer to FS since he played that in college.

FSJammer SSKiel
CBFlorence CBRolle


[/H]


I agree with you up untill you say switch Jammer to FS... keep Jammer at CB and move Florence to FS!! Jammer is alot better the florence... Have you noticed his name wasn't called that much this year... thats because he shuts down his WR's and the QB cant throwthe ball to him... Yeah he messes up sometimes but who dosen't??

That is a bunch of bull, that they dont throw at him stuff. Davis is the weakest db and jammer is right behind him. 23 is barely better than he was 2 years ago. You cant measure when they didnt throw him, but you can measure when they did. He gets beat and does not know where the ball is 90% of the time.

phicart
01-29-2005, 12:16 AM
Originally posted by: 214SD6

Originally posted by: ryear04

Originally posted by: arod9876
we should get Antrell Rolle and move jammer to FS since he played that in college.

FSJammer SSKiel
CBFlorence CBRolle


[/H]


I agree with you up untill you say switch Jammer to FS... keep Jammer at CB and move Florence to FS!! Jammer is alot better the florence... Have you noticed his name wasn't called that much this year... thats because he shuts down his WR's and the QB cant throwthe ball to him... Yeah he messes up sometimes but who dosen't??

That is a bunch of bull, that they dont throw at him stuff. Davis is the weakest db and jammer is right behind him. 23 is barely better than he was 2 years ago. You cant measure when they didnt throw him, but you can measure when they did. He gets beat and does not know where the ball is 90% of the time.

I don't know...sounds pretty harsh. You are right that Jammer's stats aren't much better than his 02 stats; and, you are right that he looked confused at times. I'm just not convinced it is all on him. He had a good year in 03 with 4 picks and 85 tackles and then had to change schemes in 04. I really think the guy was trying too hard this year to do too much. He didn't seem to play like he had any confidence in the safeties behind him.

JoeMcRugby
01-29-2005, 12:22 AM
Originally posted by: 214SD6
He gets beat and does not know where the ball is 90% of the time.

Just curious: If that's true, why don't QBs throw the ball at him 100% of the time?

A QB doing that would make Peyton Manning's stats in 2004 look like a Pop Warner rookie QB.

RMANCIL
01-29-2005, 02:06 AM
Funny why so many fans hammer Jammer, he has not played up to the level that would warrant his high 1st round selection he however has played much better than Davis.

Jammer has made strides the rule changes hurt his game a lot.

chargerfan697
02-10-2005, 03:18 AM
Okay we dont NEED to draft anyone in the secondary unless it is a beastly safety like Davis, Shazor, Poole, or Nicholeson. I think what we need to do is draft a great safety like one of them, then in Free agency sign a great CB that knows the NFL rules. There could be some great corners coming out this year in free agency such as Ken Lucas from the seahawks, or Fred Smoot from the Redskins. If we could draft one of those great safeties and sign either of those two players our secondary would be great for years to come. Also i do agree that we need some help with the pass rush for our secondary to look better, that is why our first pick should be Edwards at WR or the best DE on the board. Jammer needs to step up and play like we drafted him to play next year and Keil needs to keep playing the way he is, add all the above to that and we could go from the worst pass defence to one of the top ten next year.

phicart
02-10-2005, 08:49 PM
Originally posted by: chargerfan697
Okay we dont NEED to draft anyone in the secondary unless it is a beastly safety like Davis, Shazor, Poole, or Nicholeson. I think what we need to do is draft a great safety like one of them, then in Free agency sign a great CB that knows the NFL rules. There could be some great corners coming out this year in free agency such as Ken Lucas from the seahawks, or Fred Smoot from the Redskins. If we could draft one of those great safeties and sign either of those two players our secondary would be great for years to come. Also i do agree that we need some help with the pass rush for our secondary to look better, that is why our first pick should be Edwards at WR or the best DE on the board. Jammer needs to step up and play like we drafted him to play next year and Keil needs to keep playing the way he is, add all the above to that and we could go from the worst pass defence to one of the top ten next year.

With a "beastly" safety like Shazor(Davis - a free safety, will go in the top ten, while Poole is likewise better suited for free safety and Nicholeson is 20 pounds lighter and a tenth of a second slower than Shazor) AND a DE with killer pass rush instincts, we could probably do OK with the CB's we have for the monent. Heck, New England just won the Super Bowl with two rookie corners that got lit up more times than a Bic lighter when thrown at...it was just that the rest of the defense didn't give McNabb enough flick time. And, we could probably get those two positions filled with the draft picks we have. Question is though, will that be enough? There is an option available to get that DE at 12 and Shazor at 28 AND guarantee getting Edwards...give up Brees to one of the three top choosers and move in front of Chicago OR, work out something WITH Chicago for Brees and perhaps Malcom Floyd for their 4th this year and first next year. Right now, Chicago doesn't even have anyone on their roster who could even get the ball to Edwards if they had him.