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  #11  
Old 12-01-2012, 09:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Kemp17 View Post
I think we need one starting OT and one strong backup OT. When he's been healthy this season, Gaither has been every bit as good as he was for us last season. And we have him here on a cheap deal for a left tackle. But we absolutely have to have a better answer than Mike Harris if he can't play. And we should replace Clary, because his base salary doubles next season as his play erodes.
I agree.

Gaither is not a player you can count on, but when he does play he is a top 10 LT in this league. Getting rid of him just creates another hole on the offensive line, we need to add talent...not get rid of it.
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  #12  
Old 12-01-2012, 10:19 AM
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When I've rewatched the last few games, one thing that really stands out is Hardwick's play. It's not good. He may not have the "stats" that the OT's have in giving up sacks, but he is not giving Rivers any space to step up and avoid edge pressure.

The OT's are playing poorly, but I'd argue Hardwick is still this OL's weakest link.
Hardwick has always worn rollerskates and putting Green, aka Hardwick Jr, right next to him has been a disaster. Between the two of them there is absolutely no room for PR to step up in the pocket and I'd argue that's a bigger issue than the pressure around the edge.

I think that we should stay true to our board at any position that's not QB, DE, K or P. If the BPA is a tackle then pull the trigger. Assuming Gaither is healthy I'd have him compete against Clary and the loser of that competition is the backup RT with Harris being the backup at LT.

I'm hoping Troutman is the guy at LG but I'm not counting on it. We really need someone to step up there, and at the same time we need a stout C. Gaither and Vasquez are our only good Olinemen.
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  #13  
Old 12-01-2012, 10:42 AM
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When I've rewatched the last few games, one thing that really stands out is Hardwick's play. It's not good. He may not have the "stats" that the OT's have in giving up sacks, but he is not giving Rivers any space to step up and avoid edge pressure.

The OT's are playing poorly, but I'd argue Hardwick is still this OL's weakest link.
Join me Shammy, for I am driving the Draft Braxston Cave in the 2nd round bandwagon.
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  #14  
Old 12-01-2012, 11:48 AM
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I would say we need a blue-chip left tackle in round 1 to compete with Gaither in TC. Whoever is healthy or the better player plays on a week to week basis. Then, we need to draft a starting RT to replace Clary, and Clary becomes the backup. We need two quality tackles, preferably in the first three rounds. I would even agree with Kemp that picking up a veteran tackle in FA would be smart, but we should also be drafting and grooming a future tackle for the years to come, because it's painfully obvious Clary isn't the answer.
We do need a blue chip left tackle. But as long as Gaither is healthy, we'd be best off playing that rookie tackle on the right side. Why let him replace Gaither and play a later round rookie or Clary on the right? Gaither-Joeckel (if we landed him) would be soooo much better than any other combination that we could manage. And Joeckel could still move to the left side if/when Gaither got hurt. Then a veteran could fill in at RT. But we don't want to draft OL OL OL and ignore pass rusher, guard, corner, tight end, running back, etc.
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Old 12-01-2012, 11:53 AM
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We do need a blue chip left tackle. But as long as Gaither is healthy, we'd be best off playing that rookie tackle on the right side. Why let him replace Gaither and play a later round rookie or Clary on the right? Gaither-Joeckel (if we landed him) would be soooo much better than any other combination that we could manage. And Joeckel could still move to the left side if/when Gaither got hurt. Then a veteran could fill in at RT. But we don't want to draft OL OL OL and ignore pass rusher, guard, corner, tight end, running back, etc.
"As long as Gaither is healthy..." That's a mighty big "if."
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  #16  
Old 12-01-2012, 12:15 PM
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"As long as Gaither is healthy..." That's a mighty big "if."
Exactly. Which is why you drafted that top tackle in the first round and signed a veteran. But as long as he IS healthy, use him and have two really good pass protectors on either side.
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Old 12-01-2012, 12:23 PM
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Exactly. Which is why you drafted that top tackle in the first round and signed a veteran. But as long as he IS healthy, use him and have two really good pass protectors on either side.
I like that idea, but it still doesn't do anything to address the fact that PR doesn't have a pocket to step up into. That Green/Hardwick combo is killing Rivers. At least one of them has got to go, preferably Green.
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  #18  
Old 12-01-2012, 12:38 PM
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Troutman allowed NO sacks in 4 years! Yes, I'd love to see the kid get some PT asap. But yes, TACKLE is the biggest need, no doubt about it.
You and I will have to wait my friend, but let me tell you how big AJ was on Troutman: Troutman fell in the draft because he had to have surgery. Everyone knew it and AJ drafted him anyway KNOWING that he was going to have to eat a year for recovery. (My memory is that it was upper body, like pec. muscle or something.)
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  #19  
Old 12-01-2012, 02:06 PM
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Yes it was a pectoral injury.

I think we should start Molk right now at center or guard even just find some place for him, sign a veteran RT just for a few years then draft Jockle/Matthews in the first, and then get another tackle in the 3rd round and let him sit for a year or two and learn behind the vet tackle we bring in.

Then we could have a line that looks like Jockle/Matthews, Troutman, Molk, Vasquez/Green, a Vet tackle. The weak link would then be Vasquez/Green instead of the whole line

Last edited by chargersfan85; 12-01-2012 at 02:09 PM..
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  #20  
Old 12-01-2012, 02:13 PM
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And I would take up that argument Mr. Shamrock Shake. We might as well put two freaking revolving doors out there in the tackle slots. I mean it's God awful.

You are not the first to not be happy with Hardwick. My answer ?
We drafted the best Center in college football last season. Play David Molk from Michigan. You know they drafted him to replace Hardwick sooner or later.

TACKLES people ! We need tackles. I would draft one in the 1st round, draft a tackle/guard in later rounds. I would get a FA tackle.

Don't forget: We just drafted Troutman from Penn St. AJ is big on him, and he had some sick blocking stats in college. He's a guard, but why quibble.
I'm not a stat guy, and I certainly don't have pacstud's OL credentials for grading. I just go by what I see. OT's have been very bad. Hardwick is worse .... regardless of perception or what some goofy OL stats say.

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Join me Shammy, for I am driving the Draft Braxston Cave in the 2nd round bandwagon.
I'll get into specific college players later .... when more info (and vids) is available on each one. The Senior Bowl and practices are usually the best stuff to get info on top college OL.

I do believe the OT's are a big problem. I just think Hardwick is actually the weakest link on the OL. I watched a bunch of plays the last few games from my DVD copy, and even when the OT's did nothing wrong, Hardwick still had issues. Heck, in each of the last two games, he blocked NO ONE on multiple plays, but still was in Rivers way to step up and avoid edge pressure allowed by the OT's.

Hardwick is smart, makes the line calls, understands and blocks angles well. It is just not enough.

I'm not sold on Molk at all. In preseason, he looked like depth material. Maybe I'll feel different about him next year. Dunno ....

I am interested in seeing Troutman, but that's not going to happen this year.

Hadnot is veteran depth at best. Not starting quality. I like Green as a swing depth player, but not as a starter. Vasquez is a good starter. Not top tier, but he should be re-signed.

I do want to see an OT drafted in either the 1st or 2nd round. I hope our 1st rounder is the BPA. If the BPA is OT, then fine. If not, grab that dude.
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